Hopefully the court makes a good decision. We need to prove that a modern mine can be done in a way that protects the local environment and is fair to the people. We need more mines and we need to make them non-invasive such that future mines can be done ecologically minimally damaging for the local environment and globally helpful in ending that dreadful CO2 desaster that we all face. Good sailing everyone Agreed, now that it's actually happening, I'm fluctuating between feeling excited and nervous. Does anyone know what the court does for a whole month?I know we have a very high chance of winning. Talga made concessions to the Sami, such that Reindeer herding should be able to go on uninterrupted. We should have no issue clearing that issue. The water treatment might be tougher, but ultimately, we should be able to have no issue here either. We might get some more restrictions because of that. I can help but being a little bit on the edge about all this.
Well said @Semmel. @anbuck I attended the hearing yesterday and can help paint a bit of a picture of what that was like albeit I don't have a lot that is relevant. But for other LT TLG nuts like me I'm sure you have tried to picture what it looks like, will Greta turn up etc
And I am not a single bit surprised about the media. Of course they want to sell stories and the only story that is there, is the Sami.Thanks for the low down! If it was a fairly informal gathering, I don't understand why the session won't officially end for another month. And I really don't understand why it would take another 6-8 weeks after that!Well said @Semmel. @anbuck I attended the hearing yesterday and can help paint a bit of a picture of what that was like albeit I don't have a lot that is relevant. But for other LT TLG nuts like me I'm sure you have tried to picture what it looks like, will Greta turn up etc
Just quickly... I'd add to your thinking above Semmel and suggest that TLG have to get up on their permit app as otherwise both the EU and Sweden have quite the headache to sort out. Once upon a time I wasn't super confident with permits but always took the position that they will be approved, it just will take time. You don't have a resource like Vittangi and simply leave it idle. Fast forward to 2023 and I honestly couldn't have drafted a better macro and political set up to drive TLG's position for permit approvals. The objections and concerns raised by Stakeholders can all be addressed and permits issued, but you have to remember that a decline really would be a set back and I'm near certain force authorities under relevant or soon to be new legislation to step in and rectify the situation. It's simple, Europe needs a lot of local anode and TLG has the greenest and are far more advanced than other parties with what we know is a very large resource that can be exploited. I expect TLG is under wraps with the EU to be one of their raw materials Act poster boys.
So back to the hearing, all I really have of relevance from attending is that the decision is expected to come approximately 6-8 weeks post the hearing completion. I can see TLG have now officially stated guidance will be provided on this time frame by the court at the completion of the hearing. Here's hoping it's sooner than expectations and certainly could be given the head winds.
The Land and Environment court "hearing" for me is/was very informal and more like a gathering where all parties have a constructive chat. It wasn't anything like a formal court matter back in Aust, and I'd liken it more to something like a housing development application with your local authority. Just gathering documentation, hearing from subject experts and discussing the vested interested of various parties.
There has already been a dry run of sorts, and we know all the docs, the stakeholders and their positions and issues raised which need to be addressed - and the judicial crew have been onsite, so this is all a slow motion role back of everything with constructive dialogue. No doubt they will be sympathetic to the Saami needs, but much more important is the need to acknowledge and support the needs of the EU and the electrification movement (and of course climate change).
A dump from attending:
There were no protesters that I am aware of. None outside or inside the hotel (I was there early too)
There were 9 Saami in attendance in traditional attire and possibly another 5 (so 15 in total attending). They were all of mature age with one very young vocal child in attendance - maybe that was strategic
The Sammi were represented by a lawyer and their mayor (both spoke briefly at initial intro stage)
Talga had a team of 10 inc MP. Per Eric was in the gallery with low life's like myself and the media
I spoke with most media there and to my surprise they were all following the journey of the Sammi - I noted one column you found @cosors was written by a journo I'd spoken with and this journo really have no conviction behind what the Saami wanted or needed - IMO their job is to tell a story and get people to read it and ideally engage
That's a wrap - I'm as confident as ever!
Thank you for sharing your impressions with us and for being so thoughtful. Thank you very much!Well said @Semmel. @anbuck I attended the hearing yesterday and can help paint a bit of a picture of what that was like albeit I don't have a lot that is relevant. But for other LT TLG nuts like me I'm sure you have tried to picture what it looks like, will Greta turn up etc
Just quickly... I'd add to your thinking above Semmel and suggest that TLG have to get up on their permit app as otherwise both the EU and Sweden have quite the headache to sort out. Once upon a time I wasn't super confident with permits but always took the position that they will be approved, it just will take time. You don't have a resource like Vittangi and simply leave it idle. Fast forward to 2023 and I honestly couldn't have drafted a better macro and political set up to drive TLG's position for permit approvals. The objections and concerns raised by Stakeholders can all be addressed and permits issued, but you have to remember that a decline really would be a set back and I'm near certain force authorities under relevant or soon to be new legislation to step in and rectify the situation. It's simple, Europe needs a lot of local anode and TLG has the greenest and are far more advanced than other parties with what we know is a very large resource that can be exploited. I expect TLG is under wraps with the EU to be one of their raw materials Act poster boys.
So back to the hearing, all I really have of relevance from attending is that the decision is expected to come approximately 6-8 weeks post the hearing completion. I can see TLG have now officially stated guidance will be provided on this time frame by the court at the completion of the hearing. Here's hoping it's sooner than expectations and certainly could be given the head winds.
The Land and Environment court "hearing" for me is/was very informal and more like a gathering where all parties have a constructive chat. It wasn't anything like a formal court matter back in Aust, and I'd liken it more to something like a housing development application with your local authority. Just gathering documentation, hearing from subject experts and discussing the vested interested of various parties.
There has already been a dry run of sorts, and we know all the docs, the stakeholders and their positions and issues raised which need to be addressed - and the judicial crew have been onsite, so this is all a slow motion role back of everything with constructive dialogue. No doubt they will be sympathetic to the Saami needs, but much more important is the need to acknowledge and support the needs of the EU and the electrification movement (and of course climate change).
A dump from attending:
There were no protesters that I am aware of. None outside or inside the hotel (I was there early too)
There were 9 Saami in attendance in traditional attire and possibly another 5 (so 15 in total attending). They were all of mature age with one very young vocal child in attendance - maybe that was strategic
The Sammi were represented by a lawyer and their mayor (both spoke briefly at initial intro stage)
Talga had a team of 10 inc MP. Per Eric was in the gallery with low life's like myself and the media
I spoke with most media there and to my surprise they were all following the journey of the Sammi - I noted one column you found @cosors was written by a journo I'd spoken with and this journo really have no conviction behind what the Saami wanted or needed - IMO their job is to tell a story and get people to read it and ideally engage
That's a wrap - I'm as confident as ever!
Thanks for the update DAH - great to have you on the ground in Sweden providing live reports!!Well said @Semmel. @anbuck I attended the hearing yesterday and can help paint a bit of a picture of what that was like albeit I don't have a lot that is relevant. But for other LT TLG nuts like me I'm sure you have tried to picture what it looks like, will Greta turn up etc
Just quickly... I'd add to your thinking above Semmel and suggest that TLG have to get up on their permit app as otherwise both the EU and Sweden have quite the headache to sort out. Once upon a time I wasn't super confident with permits but always took the position that they will be approved, it just will take time. You don't have a resource like Vittangi and simply leave it idle. Fast forward to 2023 and I honestly couldn't have drafted a better macro and political set up to drive TLG's position for permit approvals. The objections and concerns raised by Stakeholders can all be addressed and permits issued, but you have to remember that a decline really would be a set back and I'm near certain force authorities under relevant or soon to be new legislation to step in and rectify the situation. It's simple, Europe needs a lot of local anode and TLG has the greenest and are far more advanced than other parties with what we know is a very large resource that can be exploited. I expect TLG is under wraps with the EU to be one of their raw materials Act poster boys.
So back to the hearing, all I really have of relevance from attending is that the decision is expected to come approximately 6-8 weeks post the hearing completion. I can see TLG have now officially stated guidance will be provided on this time frame by the court at the completion of the hearing. Here's hoping it's sooner than expectations and certainly could be given the head winds.
The Land and Environment court "hearing" for me is/was very informal and more like a gathering where all parties have a constructive chat. It wasn't anything like a formal court matter back in Aust, and I'd liken it more to something like a housing development application with your local authority. Just gathering documentation, hearing from subject experts and discussing the vested interested of various parties.
There has already been a dry run of sorts, and we know all the docs, the stakeholders and their positions and issues raised which need to be addressed - and the judicial crew have been onsite, so this is all a slow motion role back of everything with constructive dialogue. No doubt they will be sympathetic to the Saami needs, but much more important is the need to acknowledge and support the needs of the EU and the electrification movement (and of course climate change).
A dump from attending:
There were no protesters that I am aware of. None outside or inside the hotel (I was there early too)
There were 9 Saami in attendance in traditional attire and possibly another 5 (so 15 in total attending). They were all of mature age with one very young vocal child in attendance - maybe that was strategic
The Sammi were represented by a lawyer and their mayor (both spoke briefly at initial intro stage)
Talga had a team of 10 inc MP. Per Eric was in the gallery with low life's like myself and the media
I spoke with most media there and to my surprise they were all following the journey of the Sammi - I noted one column you found @cosors was written by a journo I'd spoken with and this journo really have no conviction behind what the Saami wanted or needed - IMO their job is to tell a story and get people to read it and ideally engage
That's a wrap - I'm as confident as ever!
Yes, there will be some detriment to the Sami and just maybe some minor implications to their reindeer husbandry (but maybe not). However, as we can see from recent other decisions, the greater good to be had from these projects far outweighs the implications and that is no more clear IMO than TLG's situation. Here's hoping given such, the assessors won't need 8 weeks to conclude. Imagine you're in their boots, how could you honestly substantiate a reasonable basis for a decline!?Thank you @DAH! I am pleasantly surprised about the non-drama
Of course the Sami show up in traditional clothing. Tradition and historic ownership of the land is their entire selling point. From their perspective, I can understand what they do, even if I would wish for a more measured approach. I am hoping that Talga can show that building a mine can be done in a way that doesnt collapse towns and that is respecting the Sami as well as is not damaging the environment in a big way. If they can pull that off, resistance to new mines will likely still be there but not escalate. There are too many bad examples, lets hope Talga shows how to do it right.
aww man.. 6 to 8 weeks. Knowing that NOTHING gets done before any deadline, thats mid of April. Luckily, I am busy above both ears with work, so time will fly but man its a slouch with Talga sometimes!
Anbuck, I believe there were stakeholders there from Finland but can't be sure. I only assume there was as a few raised their hands for Finnish as preferred language. I grasped maybe 10% of what was said and relied upon a couple of journo's to confirm my understanding and fill large gaps.
G'day TC. No sign of MT. Just MP and Per-Eric from my few hrs there. Not to say he may not attend if / when necessary. I'm not sure how his Swedish is, but got the feeling he wasn't too engaged with proceedings I.e., maybe a lot went over his head (as it did mine!). No interpreters that I could see. In the first sitting, TLG ran about a 1 hour preso and this was done in Swedish by two persons I wasn't aware of (something MP would usually do in public).
Ruff translation of video interview with Talga's European Chairman posted in above link.
is an interesting remark or agreement. Who would want to follow read the first post in The Bar.
MT is in Sweden and has much fun and good entertainment! https://thestockexchange.com.au/threads/media.19849/post-233248
Haha - yeah looks like Martin drew the short straw and had to sit in on the Court hearing, while MT got to watch a EV race!!MT is in Sweden and has much fun and good entertainment! https://thestockexchange.com.au/threads/media.19849/post-233248
He does have his CEO Europe and a hearing specialist and all local topics with years of experience at LKAB. I think his team is in place.
Not everyone likes to sit in the ~delivery room (I mean that bearth room) for the birth especially not when it takes so long
That was also my immediate thought that he is misinformed or wants to believe the wrong thing. In the circles and parts of politics it is the main argument that there is no need for new mines because we need to focus more on recycling. It is always about metals and here it is related to graphite in the same way. A mistake, but that's how they think in their naivety. It is the image that we only have to recycle more and then the problem is solved. I already mentioned that they have a closed bucket of arguments and it is guarded like a bulwark. But you can see that it works, they just have to repeat it among themselves, then even the last one will believe it. The man is not just anyone he is vice chairman of this biggest association in the north.
For what I read, this is normal. I think to myself that those who decide must know not believe. But I agree with you that it distorts the public image when it is reported also in the big or largest newspaper. As I said to Semmel above, it's about preserving one's own image and confirming oneself, and that unfortunately also applies to large parts of the population who do not want to leave their view. I do not exclude parts of my fellow human beings from this. That's the way it is with voters and people in general. What can't be can't be. But yes, good or neutral journalism looks different.
