TLG Ann: Talga Investor Webinar - 9th Feb 2023, 12:53pm

[teilenswert]

I can only recommend everyone to watch the recording of the video as soon as it is available. I find it impressive how Mark always manages to get the story across and share new, interesting insights. Unfortunately, it didn't sound to me like we were already on the home straight with the Offtake Agreements and I also found it incomprehensible at first why we probably still have to wait a while for resource upgrades (but found the explanation conclusive that these are costly activities that are not really relevant to the path ahead and have therefore been deprioritised). Apart from that, however, many comments seemed to be extremely bullish, especially on the topic of Talnode-Si Mark was "beaming like a honey cake horse" (does that German saying translate into English?), and the allusion to 4680 batteries in Europe was also well placed.

 

[Diogenese]

I can only recommend everyone to watch the recording of the video as soon as it is available. I find it impressive how Mark always manages to get the story across and share new, interesting insights. Unfortunately, it didn't sound to me like we were already on the home straight with the Offtake Agreements and I also found it incomprehensible at first why we probably still have to wait a while for resource upgrades (but found the explanation conclusive that these are costly activities that are not really relevant to the path ahead and have therefore been deprioritised). Apart from that, however, many comments seemed to be extremely bullish, especially on the topic of Talnode-Si Mark was "beaming like a honey cake horse" (does that German saying translate into English?), and the allusion to 4680 batteries in Europe was also well placed.

Cheshire cat is the best we've got:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cheshire_Cat

 

[Affenhorst]

I can only recommend everyone to watch the recording of the video as soon as it is available. I find it impressive how Mark always manages to get the story across and share new, interesting insights. Unfortunately, it didn't sound to me like we were already on the home straight with the Offtake Agreements and I also found it incomprehensible at first why we probably still have to wait a while for resource upgrades (but found the explanation conclusive that these are costly activities that are not really relevant to the path ahead and have therefore been deprioritised). Apart from that, however, many comments seemed to be extremely bullish, especially on the topic of Talnode-Si Mark was "beaming like a honey cake horse" (does that German saying translate into English?), and the allusion to 4680 batteries in Europe was also well placed.

Takes some dedication as a stock holder to stay up until 3am to watch some webinar

Looking forward to catch the recording.

 

[cosors]

I wanted to ask a question - but it’s not really a webinar question so I’ll just put it out here if anyone wants to have a crack.

I’m always looking for risk mitigation so -

Talga have submitted an application for a mine permit from the land and environment court but in the court case it was suggested that there are up to 4 possible mines planned and the criticism against Talga was that the application should have been made collectively for all the mines. Does a negative ruling mean the end of the road for Talga or is there an appeal process ? Given the changing legislative landscape with the introduction of the new bill , could the additional proposed mines provide Talga with a loophole to reapply for permits ?

I don't think you need to worry or worry at all. The court has decided that this case will be heard and so it is. Only NS will be decided. This is just a tactic of the opponents to delay. They would vote against it anyway even if it was about a bio bin.
The other issue is a possible no. This opens up the possibility for the government to intervene if I understand it correctly. They even passed a new law last year suspending the environmental permit to enable the company to act, if understood correctly. From my point of view, a no vote would not be the end of the matter. And in the case of a yes we have to expect an appeal anyway. The court is concerned with balancing the interests and both are of national interest. Our side is the one that accommodates the court and is willing to make the court's job easier by compromising and making concessions. The opponents are not willing to do that. I think this attitude will also have an impact. But all that is just my feeling. I am not a lawyer.

 

[Semmel]

It would be too ironic if the court decided that Talgas proposal to only mine during summer is rejected because the Sami were not willing to compromise and therefore grants the permit to mine all year around.. of course that is not going to happen but it would be funny.

 

[TentCity]

I can only recommend everyone to watch the recording of the video as soon as it is available. I find it impressive how Mark always manages to get the story across and share new, interesting insights. Unfortunately, it didn't sound to me like we were already on the home straight with the Offtake Agreements and I also found it incomprehensible at first why we probably still have to wait a while for resource upgrades (but found the explanation conclusive that these are costly activities that are not really relevant to the path ahead and have therefore been deprioritised). Apart from that, however, many comments seemed to be extremely bullish, especially on the topic of Talnode-Si Mark was "beaming like a honey cake horse" (does that German saying translate into English?), and the allusion to 4680 batteries in Europe was also well placed.

On a completely unrelated note - geez it is impressive how well you, Cosors & Semmel can write in English given it is your second language…..better than many locals here! Sorry if i missed any other members - not sure where everyone is based!

I’m up to L5 in duo lingo learning German with my son and i can only order a coffee; say the cat is nice and the pizza is too cold . We’re doing 20mins a day and will be interesting to see where we get by the end of the year!!

 

[TentCity]

Back to business on Talga and one more thing that struck me on Talnode Si and I wish I could remember Mark’s exact wording, but he said something along the lines of they are now up to Generation 3 (Gen 3) and basically we ain’t seen nothing yet and their tech is going to revolutionise this space. Please don’t hold me to getting 100% right, but it was an incredibly bullish off the cuff comment by MT on how much potential he sees in Talnode-Si.

Hopefully, it is not edited out of the investor video and you can all see for yourselves!

Finally, as per Teilenwert’s post above, the resource upgrade was deliberately put on hold to save cash and was deemed non-urgent, but sounds like it is back on track now and we’ll see it released relatively soon.

 

[Affenhorst]

Back to business on Talga and one more thing that struck me on Talnode Si and I wish I could remember Mark’s exact wording, but he said something along the lines of they are now up to Generation 3 (Gen 3) and basically we ain’t seen nothing yet and their tech is going to revolutionise this space. Please don’t hold me to getting 100% right, but it was an incredibly bullish off the cuff comment by MT on how much potential he sees in Talnode-Si.

Hopefully, it is not edited out of the investor video and you can all see for yourselves!

Finally, as per Teilenwert’s post above, the resource upgrade was deliberately put on hold to save cash and was deemed non-urgent, but sounds like it is back on track now and we’ll see it released relatively soon.

That sounds kinda cool and maybe they've got some secret sauce. But the fact that they won't need Vittangi graphite for it could mean that others might be able to make something similar without too much difficulty, that there is no moat like with Talnode-C. Let's hope for the best.

 

[Diogenese]

That sounds kinda cool and maybe they've got some secret sauce. But the fact that they won't need Vittangi graphite for it could mean that others might be able to make something similar without too much difficulty, that there is no moat like with Talnode-C. Let's hope for the best.

As Mick Dundee always says:
"That's not a moat - this is a moat."

WO2020261194A1 SILICON AND GRAPHITE CONTAINING COMPOSITE MATERIAL AND METHOD FOR PRODUCING SAME

Applicants TALGA TECH LIMITED [GB]​

Priorities AU2019902306A·2019-06-28​

​

A method (10) for the production of a composite material (42) comprising: Subjecting silicon particles (16) to a size reduction step (18) with graphite particles (20) in a solvent and/or in the presence of a polymer, to produce coated silicon nanoparticles (26); Processing the product of step (i) with or without a binder to produce composites (32); Thermal treatment of the composites (32) of step (ii), thereby producing a composite material (12) comprising a plurality of coated silicon nanoparticles, graphite particles and a carbon matrix, wherein the graphite particles are held within the carbon matrix; Coating of the composites (12) of step (iii) with a binder (36); and Thermal treatment of the composites (38) of step (iv) thereby producing a shell comprising amorphous carbon. A silicon and graphite containing composite material is also disclosed.

 

[Diogenese]

As Mick Dundee always says:
"That's not a moat - this is a moat."

WO2020261194A1 SILICON AND GRAPHITE CONTAINING COMPOSITE MATERIAL AND METHOD FOR PRODUCING SAME

Applicants TALGA TECH LIMITED [GB]​

Priorities AU2019902306A·2019-06-28​

​

View attachment 29858

A method (10) for the production of a composite material (42) comprising: Subjecting silicon particles (16) to a size reduction step (18) with graphite particles (20) in a solvent and/or in the presence of a polymer, to produce coated silicon nanoparticles (26); Processing the product of step (i) with or without a binder to produce composites (32); Thermal treatment of the composites (32) of step (ii), thereby producing a composite material (12) comprising a plurality of coated silicon nanoparticles, graphite particles and a carbon matrix, wherein the graphite particles are held within the carbon matrix; Coating of the composites (12) of step (iii) with a binder (36); and Thermal treatment of the composites (38) of step (iv) thereby producing a shell comprising amorphous carbon. A silicon and graphite containing composite material is also disclosed.

Who else can just sweep graphene up off the floor after processing their own natural graphite?

 

[Vigdorian]

Unfortunately I had a work MsTeams meeting on one screen and the webinar on the other so it was challenging to take it all in (or any) so I’ll wait for the recording but from the bits that I did hear and read here , as usual I thought MT covered quite a bit.

Permit question fully answered
I also understand the excitement on talnode si (gr-si) and how close it is to commercialization.

MT did refer to the coated ship being in the Bermuda Triangle which was exactly what another poster said in hotcropper prior to the meeting. There’s no coincidences with MT.

I did feel like there was a stark contrast between the last webinar and this webinar. In the last webinar MT said something along the lines of we’re confident with the permit process and where we are , the decision will be final , the features of vittangi are critical to our value proposition, etc. This time around, he expanded on the permit process and mentioned that should we be unsuccessful, there are other options available but it spoke not only to the mines themselves but to the product offerings. It felt like there was a bit of hedging going on should we need to pivot but also marked growing confidence of TLG as a technology company. All will be known in due course.

… and to a previous comment made here - it’s a small world - Sir Joseph banks park in botany is actually quite close to where I live and there is a plaque from memory that mentions this so called botanist (I’ll take a pic next time I’m there)… TLG my favourite company - hopefully it stays this way after the permit decision.

 

[Diogenese]

Unfortunately I had a work MsTeams meeting on one screen and the webinar on the other so it was challenging to take it all in (or any) so I’ll wait for the recording but from the bits that I did hear and read here , as usual I thought MT covered quite a bit.

Permit question fully answered
I also understand the excitement on talnode si (gr-si) and how close it is to commercialization.

MT did refer to the coated ship being in the Bermuda Triangle which was exactly what another poster said in hotcropper prior to the meeting. There’s no coincidences with MT.

I did feel like there was a stark contrast between the last webinar and this webinar. In the last webinar MT said something along the lines of we’re confident with the permit process and where we are , the decision will be final , the features of vittangi are critical to our value proposition, etc. This time around, he expanded on the permit process and mentioned that should we be unsuccessful, there are other options available but it spoke not only to the mines themselves but to the product offerings. It felt like there was a bit of hedging going on should we need to pivot but also marked growing confidence of TLG as a technology company. All will be known in due course.

… and to a previous comment made here - it’s a small world - St Joseph banks park in botany is actually quite close to where I live and there is a plaque from memory that mentions this so called botanist (I’ll take a pic next time I’m there)… TLG my favourite company - hopefully it stays this way after the permit decision.

Well even if the permit is refused, we still have the option of licensing our IP. In particular, I see the Talnose-Si patent as being especially valuable. A 100% Talnode-Si anode battery has 5 times the capacity of a standard LIthium battery. Even 9% Talnode-Si increases the capacity by 40%.

These are sensational figures.

I guess Talnode-Si is significantly more expensive than pure graphite, but how would is compare with solid electrolyte?

 

[anbuck]

Webinar Recording:

 

[Diogenese]

Webinar Recording:

I noticed the graphite Tesal was well in evidence, both with Mark as well as with Ebba.

A couple of intriguing moments:

20:00: 4680 and 811 is a good spot for it if you know what I mean (wink, wink, nudge, nudge)

https://history-computer.com/4680-battery-cells/#:~:text=The 4680 is Tesla’s fourth type of lithium-ion,a more powerful performance than Tesla’s other EVBs.

• The 4680 is Tesla’s fourth type of lithium-ion EV battery. Since it’s larger than its three predecessors the 18650, 2170, and prismatic-type, it offers a longer range and a more powerful performance than Tesla’s other EVBs.

48:30 the reasons for being in Germany are multi-various which can’t talk about ... once we've hooked up a customer who'd be able to finance that (Talnode-Si trials) … we'll’ talk more about it when we can ... 51:05 elongated smirk

Let's hope Mark does not play poker ...

 

[cosors]

On a completely unrelated note - geez it is impressive how well you, Cosors & Semmel can write in English given it is your second language…..better than many locals here! Sorry if i missed any other members - not sure where everyone is based!

I’m up to L5 in duo lingo learning German with my son and i can only order a coffee; say the cat is nice and the pizza is too cold . We’re doing 20mins a day and will be interesting to see where we get by the end of the year!!

Don't worry about it. English is much much easier and it is also more useful because it is spoken all over the world. The motivation is therefore also different.
German is very very complicated and some moral cultists here insist on making the language far more complicated for newcomers.
Anyway, I started learning English more intensively only a year ago here and through all the webinars, podcasts and other contributions with audio, mostly from the BRN group, as there is tons of material.
I am/was a language cripple (?) and already did badly at school. But now I realise that the daily work here on TSE is bearing fruit. I could even get through audits in English unscathed.
teilenswert mentioned DeepL. I use this tool exclusively and only extremely rarely have to use Google translation (e.g. for Japanese). I recommend you to try it out to translate into German or vice versa. The tool makes suggestions when you tap on the passage or word with a right click of your mouse. You can use it to adjust the words and phrases. It was a great help for me especially for yours Down Under, but also for other dialects. When you book a paid account you can create your own glossaries.
Of course, there is not the same motive for learning German as there is for us to learn English e.g. for the work here on TSE or in investment in general. But maybe you just look for something that interests you in Germany and the corresponding media and then install the app from DeepL. Once installed, you only have to press copy twice and everything happens automatically. Very handy! The grammar, syntax and sentence structure is also much better than the competition. This is especially important for learning to write German. There are a lot of commas and you have to understand when to put it or not... actually, one always fits ,
Even the NYT thinks it's the best translator. By the way, it comes from my city and hasn't been bought out by Google because there are no shares just that simple - LoL.
...worth 1,5B.)
https://www.deepl.com/translator

____
harrr
"Tech giants Google, Microsoft and Facebook are all applying the lessons of machine learning to translation, but a small company called DeepL has outdone them all and raised the bar for the field.
Its translation tool is just as quick as the outsized competition, but more accurate and nuanced than any we’ve tried.
TechCrunch
USA"

 

[Affenhorst]

So I watched the recording now and I can say that I'm pleased. Marc sounded confident and there are lot of good things coming for us. We just need... Patience. Sigh. Looking forward to the first offtakes. Especially curious about any arrangements regarding Talnode-Si...

 

[TentCity]

A couple of additional things I picked up from the webinar that hasn’t been mentioned by others includes the status of Talga’s presence in Japan.

We know Dr Capigilio, Head of Talga’s Battery Tech, has been based there for many years and formerly worked for Toyota & Panasonic. But, if i heard correctly, Mark said Dr Capilglio was “up until recently” based in Japan and things have been consolidated to Europe?

Adding to this, on the slide where Mark spoke about partners, he said something along the lines of this list is fluid and things are changing as plans progress. I also noticed MT didn’t mention the planned 60:40 funding split between debt:equity and emphasised how the debt funding negotiations have matured really well and there is the ability for the company to take on more project debt than previously planned.

Combining all these things, I wonder if Dr Capiglio is leaving Japan and the financing options available to Talga have improved to such an extent, that Mitsui is no longer in the running, which I have suspected for some time to be honest. I just can’t see what value they bring to the table anymore to justify them getting a chunk of the project given all the action is initially in Europe and then likely in Nth America.

This is before the release of the CRM Act and Net Zero Act, which might further improve the funding options available to Talga. So, in short, I’m speculating that Mitsui is out and the MOU will not be renewed by March 30 (current deadline). I just hope MT has announced who the alternative strategic partners may be before then as we may not have a decision on permits by that date (6-8wks) - so don’t want that to spook the market. A nice strategic partnership on Talnode Si with a commercial partner would go a long way to settle any concerns about Mitsui exiting stage left.

I also do not fully grasp why we Talga has an office in Hong Kong. Given Talga are deliberately prioritising European OEM customers for supply to ensure they position themselves well for EU loans, why have the office there? The only connection i can think of is via LTT/Foxconn who are in Taiwan/China, but not sure that in itself requires having a permanent presence there? Any others have insights why Talga would consider that a worthwhile presence to maintain?

One final comment on Talnode Si is I’m guessing the upgraded qualification plant at Rudolstadt is for testing larger samples of Gen 2.0 of Talnode Si and Gen 3, which Mark mentioned could revolutionise the industry is being tested in the newly upgraded Cambridge R&D facility. The incredibly bullish commentary Mark used around the developments going on behind the scenes is uncharacteristic of his typically conservative nature and is very exciting for us shareholders to see how this unfolds during the year!

 

[anbuck]

A couple of additional things I picked up from the webinar that hasn’t been mentioned by others includes the status of Talga’s presence in Japan.

We know Dr Capigilio, Head of Talga’s Battery Tech, has been based there for many years and formerly worked for Toyota & Panasonic. But, if i heard correctly, Mark said Dr Capilglio was “up until recently” based in Japan and things have been consolidated to Europe?

Adding to this, on the slide where Mark spoke about partners, he said something along the lines of this list is fluid and things are changing as plans progress. I also noticed MT didn’t mention the planned 60:40 funding split between debt:equity and emphasised how the debt funding negotiations have matured really well and there is the ability for the company to take on more project debt than previously planned.

Combining all these things, I wonder if Dr Capiglio is leaving Japan and the financing options available to Talga have improved to such an extent, that Mitsui is no longer in the running, which I have suspected for some time to be honest. I just can’t see what value they bring to the table anymore to justify them getting a chunk of the project given all the action is initially in Europe and then likely in Nth America.

This is before the release of the CRM Act and Net Zero Act, which might further improve the funding options available to Talga. So, in short, I’m speculating that Mitsui is out and the MOU will not be renewed by March 30 (current deadline). I just hope MT has announced who the alternative strategic partners may be before then as we may not have a decision on permits by that date (6-8wks) - so don’t want that to spook the market. A nice strategic partnership on Talnode Si with a commercial partner would go a long way to settle any concerns about Mitsui exiting stage left.

I also do not fully grasp why we Talga has an office in Hong Kong. Given Talga are deliberately prioritising European OEM customers for supply to ensure they position themselves well for EU loans, why have the office there? The only connection i can think of is via LTT/Foxconn who are in Taiwan/China, but not sure that in itself requires having a permanent presence there? Any others have insights why Talga would consider that a worthwhile presence to maintain?

One final comment on Talnode Si is I’m guessing the upgraded qualification plant at Rudolstadt is for testing larger samples of Gen 2.0 of Talnode Si and Gen 3, which Mark mentioned could revolutionise the industry is being tested in the newly upgraded Cambridge R&D facility. The incredibly bullish commentary Mark used around the developments going on behind the scenes is uncharacteristic of his typically conservative nature and is very exciting for us shareholders to see how this unfolds during the year!

Agreed, I interpreted Mark's comments as suggesting that Mitsui is out. He said that the slide demonstrated a "history" of working with top companies.

Additionally, I'm curious if anyone knows what he meant when he said that there could be some negative effects of the critical minerals legislation?

 

[catdog]

A couple of additional things I picked up from the webinar that hasn’t been mentioned by others includes the status of Talga’s presence in Japan.

We know Dr Capigilio, Head of Talga’s Battery Tech, has been based there for many years and formerly worked for Toyota & Panasonic. But, if i heard correctly, Mark said Dr Capilglio was “up until recently” based in Japan and things have been consolidated to Europe?

Adding to this, on the slide where Mark spoke about partners, he said something along the lines of this list is fluid and things are changing as plans progress. I also noticed MT didn’t mention the planned 60:40 funding split between debt:equity and emphasised how the debt funding negotiations have matured really well and there is the ability for the company to take on more project debt than previously planned.

Combining all these things, I wonder if Dr Capiglio is leaving Japan and the financing options available to Talga have improved to such an extent, that Mitsui is no longer in the running, which I have suspected for some time to be honest. I just can’t see what value they bring to the table anymore to justify them getting a chunk of the project given all the action is initially in Europe and then likely in Nth America.

This is before the release of the CRM Act and Net Zero Act, which might further improve the funding options available to Talga. So, in short, I’m speculating that Mitsui is out and the MOU will not be renewed by March 30 (current deadline). I just hope MT has announced who the alternative strategic partners may be before then as we may not have a decision on permits by that date (6-8wks) - so don’t want that to spook the market. A nice strategic partnership on Talnode Si with a commercial partner would go a long way to settle any concerns about Mitsui exiting stage left.

I also do not fully grasp why we Talga has an office in Hong Kong. Given Talga are deliberately prioritising European OEM customers for supply to ensure they position themselves well for EU loans, why have the office there? The only connection i can think of is via LTT/Foxconn who are in Taiwan/China, but not sure that in itself requires having a permanent presence there? Any others have insights why Talga would consider that a worthwhile presence to maintain?

One final comment on Talnode Si is I’m guessing the upgraded qualification plant at Rudolstadt is for testing larger samples of Gen 2.0 of Talnode Si and Gen 3, which Mark mentioned could revolutionise the industry is being tested in the newly upgraded Cambridge R&D facility. The incredibly bullish commentary Mark used around the developments going on behind the scenes is uncharacteristic of his typically conservative nature and is very exciting for us shareholders to see how this unfolds during the year!

I agree about Japan and Mitsui. I have always wondered what they would bring to the table outside of funding and potential relationships with Japanese OEMs/battery manufacturers. The situation has materially changed with the funding options now available to Talga and the focus on Europe so they're likely no longer required. I think it also made sense while Talga were refining their technology as I believe they were working closely with Japanese companies for the Talnode C and Talnode Si testing. Mark also mentioned that some of the manufacturing equipment suppliers were Japanese.

I also agree that Hong Kong is likely for the LTT/Foxconn relationship and maybe some chinese battery manufactuers. Hong Kong makes sense as a location for a corporate presence close to these partners. Purely speculation but as these chinese manufacturers scale globally, Talnode Si could easily be a drop in solution for their anode. With EU and US "green new deal" regulations I believe there are requirements for a certain percentage of the material to be sourced domestically. Talga could be a way for them to meet these requirements.

The Gen 3 comment was interesting and something I'll need to do some further research into. As I understand the graphite in Talnode Si is still used for lithiation. Mark made a comment about them investigating options for the graphite to be used as a "framework" for the silicon rather than for lithiation. I wonder if that's the gen 3 he's referring to and how it could revolutionise the the industry. I haven't got my head around it yet but will do some digging.

 

[anbuck]

Mark made a comment about them investigating options for the graphite to be used as a "framework" for the silicon rather than for lithiation

I assume by this he means that the graphite/graphene are providing a structure around the silicon to reduce expansion when the silicon becomes lithiated. If Gen 3 were to be revolutionary, it would likely be because it allowed the use of high-silicon anodes without reducing cycle life. I'm sure they are iterating on how best to create the graphite/graphene structure around the silicon and Gen 3 is likely their latest iteration.