AVZ Discussion 2022

[Carlos Danger]

Wait, are you intimating that we could now be positioning to pay Cong...gasp...the lousy extra 20m he originally sought!?

No. I'm intimating that if we win all the court cases and still don't get the ML or have a deal and we need to start seizing assets to recoup funds, that our damages claim against Cong at the ICC will be more than 20m and Locke will be paid back using the money sitting in Christian Lukusa's bank account.

I had no idea how much more Cong wanted. All the court records say he wanted an expert to value it. How did you know the amount?

 

[Xerof]

What a crock! I’d love to know what our entire executive branch is doing with their over 1k per day Pay packets and bonuses! MMGA was a complete hustle to distract us from tearing the entire lot of them a new arsehole. Should have all been put on notice but instead we were defending a false flag. Everyone here all the posts blaming this government DRC and AUS. There is only one person responsible for this predicament and he’s barely getting a mention. Starts with an N.

Norman?

 

[wombat74]

Early ICSID results are about maintaining the status quo. We won't have a hearing about the merits until June 2025. Although I am extremely confident that Dathcom will win.

It's not really a question of the value of the project for any potential funding supplier. It's about ability to recover their investment. Locke aren't taking equity but you can bet your bottom dollar they will be first in line to get paid back. 20 million usd is an awfully familiar amount. I was just talking about it yesterday

Looks to me like the Chinese want to get the North into production , leave Roche Dure stranded and tie AVZ up in legal sh1t .

I forgot about Cong's $20mil held in escrow . Can it be used as collateral to secure the loan ? If negotiations fail with Cong can we access the $20mil or must it remain in escrow until the ICSID process is complete ?

 

[timb89]

So all that talk at the roadshow and then of the MoU about going mining was all bullshit?

Pretty sure we could have gotten a good offer with 75% of the latest drilling if that was the case

If it was me, from a negotiation stand point, I'd have never removed the narrative of going mining from the forefront. Eg. We can sell this to you and make money, or we can take it to mine and make more money. More strength in removing the idea of sale from the table. Makes them the buyer as opposed to us being the seller.

In terms of the upgrading of the resource, I absolutely think the more we have proved the more strength that gives us from a buy out perspective. Eg. "We have 200Mt but everyone knows it has more" isn't going to factor into the bottom line calculations the accountants are doing to price the asset.

Continuing drilling also showed that we are going ahead, business as usual, doing our job etc. Also more work done on the project only helps our case with ISCID.

Not to say you're wrong, we could have got a good price without drilling more, hopefully a calculated risk from management.

 

[pow4ade]

No. I'm intimating that if we win all the court cases and still don't get the ML or have a deal and we need to start seizing assets to recoup funds, that our damages claim against Cong at the ICC will be more than 20m and Locke will be paid back using the money sitting in Christian Lukusa's bank account.

I had no idea how much more Cong wanted. All the court records say he wanted an expert to value it. How did you know the amount?

I had no idea how much more Cong wanted. All the court records say he wanted an expert to value it. How did you know the amount?

Thought this was common knowledge yet can't locate the original source. Here's the most recent mention:

If Dathomir had requested an additional 20 million and AVZ had approached the market, explaining the extraordinary circumstances and the need to revaluate the deal's fairness, the market would likely have understood. The 75 million placement was oversubscribed by 20 million, so raising funds was not an issue.

https://hotcrapper.com.au/threads/risk-versus-reward.7842550/page-13

 

[Cumquat Cap]

Dathomir would never be happy as their sole intention is the destruction of $avz at the behest of their Chinese overlords. Cong is a criminal and has $20 million sitting under the bao bun in his kitchen. Go for the throat with that scumbag

 

[wombat74]

Yes that's my read on it too

Potentially. But not because of negotiations failing. It could possibly be accessed if we win our case against Cong at the ICC and get a damages award of more than 20m. In that event we could seize the returned money to pay back Locke and still retain our good legal title of 75% of Dathcom for the purposes of our case at the ICSID against the DRC government.

What is the possibility in exchange for the ML we give Dathomir back the 15% ? What's better 51% or years in court and no $$$$$?
AVZ 51%
CATH 19%
DRC 15 %
dath 15%

AVZ 51%
Dath 15%
Cath 9 %
DRC 25%

 

[Lucas Don Velor]

Early ICSID results are about maintaining the status quo. We won't have a hearing about the merits until June 2025. Although I am extremely confident that Dathcom will win.

It's not really a question of the value of the project for any potential funding supplier. It's about ability to recover their investment. Locke aren't taking equity but you can bet your bottom dollar they will be first in line to get paid back. 20 million usd is an awfully familiar amount. I was just talking about it yesterday

100% agree... A strategic amount!

 

[Carlos Danger]

I had no idea how much more Cong wanted. All the court records say he wanted an expert to value it. How did you know the amount?

Thought this was common knowledge yet can't locate the original source. Here's the most recent mention:

If Dathomir had requested an additional 20 million and AVZ had approached the market, explaining the extraordinary circumstances and the need to revaluate the deal's fairness, the market would likely have understood. The 75 million placement was oversubscribed by 20 million, so raising funds was not an issue.

https://hotcrapper.com.au/threads/risk-versus-reward.7842550/page-13

Yeah imma go with Cong's submission to the court rather than some hypothetical amount pulled out of the ass of some idiot on the crapper

Any expert worth their salt would have valued at least the 2020 agreement at the DFS price. Which would be significantly more than 20m. That is what the IGF is big mad at Cominiere and the MoP for after all.

 

[wombat74]

Dathomir would never be happy as their sole intention is the destruction of $avz at the behest of their Chinese overlords. Cong is a criminal and has $20 million sitting under the bao bun in his kitchen. Go for the throat with that scumbag

Problem is the Chinese don't give a f--k . The DRC gov and Cong are best buddies . Nigel needs to sort something other than going down the legal rabbit hole for the next 10 years . imo

 

[Cumquat Cap]

Agreed, won’t go into specifics as to what I’d accept but yes, I 100% agree.

Can’t play the long game with these ducking animals

 

[SilentOne]

Problem is the Chinese don't give a f--k . The DRC gov and Cong are best buddies . Nigel needs to sort something other than going down the legal rabbit hole for the next 10 years . imo

Wombat,

You may find that Nigel was playing nice but it got AVZ/Dathcom nowhere - to get a fair outcome he has had his hand forced and we now find ourselves litigating (not through choice). I suspect that you would be the first to complain if AVZ sold our interests in Dathcom at a discount.

Lets wait for the rulings as they apply to the ICC and ICSID cases and if in the meantime we can settle the dispute with a good outcome for AVZ shareholders then that would be great.

The extra drilling results have in my opinion further highlighted the value of Dathcom and has the world's attention. Manono is a strategic mineral and I cant see the CCP being permitted to steal or control both the mine and the lithium spot price by default through nefarious means.


Just a thought bubble - SilentOne

 

[Roon]

Either Cong comes to the table in good faith or he will be put to the sword in 7 months imo
View attachment 56941

Any indication when the Dathomir case is to be heard at ICC? You'd think it would have to be tabled and completed in the next few months if there was to be an award by around September 2024 as per the AVZ management's original reported timeline

For that matter too, have you heard of any dates thrown around for the Cominiere case to progress at ICC?

 

[Carlos Danger]

Any indication when the Dathomir case is to be heard at ICC? You'd think it would have to be tabled and completed in the next few months if there was to be an award by around September 2024 as per the AVZ management's original reported timeline

For that matter too, have you heard of any dates thrown around for the Cominiere case to progress at ICC?

 

[Roon]

View attachment 56944
View attachment 56945

Thanks Carlos, with the defence due to be filed by March 2024 after we issued our claims in Nov 2023, the case itself could plausibly be heard in the following months. If so and if no significant delays in scheduling, then an award could foreseeably occur in late 2024 should there be a rapid outcome (at least in ICC terms). Cong must be starting to sweat!

Who I'd really like to sweat though is Celestin Kibeya, so the sooner the ICC locks in some dates for further action on the case (27720/SP) we launched against Cominiere in April 2023 the better.The last AVZ announcements on this case are referring to the Emergency Orders, and i think the last reference madr by AVZ regarding the broader case just said it will be heard by a 3-member panel in due course.

 

[pow4ade]

Yeah imma go with Cong's submission to the court rather than some hypothetical amount pulled out of the ass of some idiot on the crapper

Any expert worth their salt would have valued at least the 2020 agreement at the DFS price. Which would be significantly more than 20m. That is what the IGF is big mad at Cominiere and the MoP for after all.

View attachment 56939

From memory it was more than a hypothetical but rather an active discussion at the time, the basic sentiment being: 'FFS, it's only 20m, pay the bastard and let's get on with it'.

Further, it wouldn't be a stretch to say that extra 20m would have informed the dodgy local court in ruling that Dathcom pay Dathomir $50m, ie 20.5 + 20 + 9.5 for snacks or whatever.

Unless others can confirm this, however, I'm happy to consider it unverified for the moment.

 

[Pokok]

So after reading all this you guys are now saying a timeline for a decision is september , well that has changed from last year thinking about February this year , when at the time I said March this year , lets just say nobody really knows timelines , court outcomes , etc if we have no company update then the company still knows nothing or are in discussion ( I DONT SEE WHO WITH ) about some sort of resolution why they can't update us ? because I believe they have know Idea also what is going on .. Corruption at its best and I anybody is happy here to still be discussing this situation this time next year because of a good outcome I call bullshit . Just follow all the stock rises you missed out on over the next year if Lithium prices really increase . I want to sell out and get trading better companies .

 

[Roon]

So after reading all this you guys are now saying a timeline for a decision is september , well that has changed from last year thinking about February this year , when at the time I said March this year , lets just say nobody really knows timelines , court outcomes , etc if we have no company update then the company still knows nothing or are in discussion ( I DONT SEE WHO WITH ) about some sort of resolution why they can't update us ? because I believe they have know Idea also what is going on .. Corruption at its best and I anybody is happy here to still be discussing this situation this time next year because of a good outcome I call bullshit . Just follow all the stock rises you missed out on over the next year if Lithium prices really increase . I want to sell out and get trading better companies .

I don't think it's changed. From my recollection the company said from the start that they wouldn't reasonably expect any final award regarding the Dathomir case before Sep 2024.

My suspicion is that it will drag to the right a little, but that would still be pretty good progress for an ICC case.

 

[Winenut]

Fucking over it

Talking in circles

No news that anything is progressing

Zijin drilling the north with inpunity

No ML in sight

No deal in sight

No compromise in sight

No indication that we will relist anytime soon and shareholders continuing to be financially fucked over

Complete shitshow

 

[Carlos Danger]

So after reading all this you guys are now saying a timeline for a decision is september , well that has changed from last year thinking about February this year , when at the time I said March this year , lets just say nobody really knows timelines , court outcomes , etc if we have no company update then the company still knows nothing or are in discussion ( I DONT SEE WHO WITH ) about some sort of resolution why they can't update us ? because I believe they have know Idea also what is going on .. Corruption at its best and I anybody is happy here to still be discussing this situation this time next year because of a good outcome I call bullshit . Just follow all the stock rises you missed out on over the next year if Lithium prices really increase . I want to sell out and get trading better companies .

Fucking over it

Talking in circles

No news that anything is progressing

Zijin drilling the north without inpunity

No ML in sight

No deal in sight

No compromise in sight

No indication that we will relist anytime soon and shareholders continuing to be financially fucked over

Complete shitshow

According to 9card the jurisdictional challenge decision in the Zijin 15% of Dathcom case is due this month. This result will have massive flow on effects for all of the other cases except Dathomir particularly our case against Cominiere at the ICC that is also set to determine if the Dathcom JVA is still valid.

The Dathomir matter is slightly more complex to sort out due to the criminal complaint considerations within the DRC and without Cong conceding that the SPA's were completed correctly we will need to wait until final ICC decision later this year to have this resolved

Management are being pretty open about the fact that they want a negotiated outcome for all matters and to move the project forward. The question is are our enemies coming to the table or are they just trying to stall and see if they can find a way to negotiate with someone else instead.

Their latest plot after the attempted coup at the AGM spectacularly failed is to try and remove Nigel and John Clarke from the bod in the WA Supreme Court seemingly using a claim of 'oppressive conduct' regarding the northern area

If management had something viable from our enemies they would take it. But China are throwing the kitchen sink at trying to take Nigel's power away as he won't sell us down the river like that clown Huljich. If we give them an inch on their terms they will take the whole 221 carrés imo