AVZ Discussion 2022

[protoje]

I’m not going to pretend to be more informed than anyone. And I know this is simplistic. And none of us wanted this. But from proceedings I’m going to surmise Zijin and Felix know the story with ownership and they’re colluding to smoke us out. If that’s the case, couldn’t the three parties negotiate to
1. Give us a decent offer rather than wait for final ICSID in 2026 (that time is our carrot here, the longer we leave it the less tasty that carrot gets because they might as well wait- after that Felix can still come up with some bullshit reason not to give us the license)
2. We withdraw from legal proceedings once the money is in the bank
3. Felix agrees to grant the mining license to them upon ownership (fucked but is what it is)
4. We eat cray rather than go cray.

 

[CHB]

I’m not going to pretend to be more informed than anyone. And I know this is simplistic. And none of us wanted this. But from proceedings I’m going to surmise Zijin and Felix know the story with ownership and they’re colluding to smoke us out. If that’s the case, couldn’t the three parties negotiate to
1. Give us a decent offer rather than wait for final ICSID in 2026 (that time is our carrot here, the longer we leave it the less tasty that carrot gets because they might as well wait- after that Felix can still come up with some bullshit reason not to give us the license)
2. We withdraw from legal proceedings once the money is in the bank
3. Felix agrees to grant the mining license to them upon ownership (fucked but is what it is)
4. We eat cray rather than go cray.

Personally think this is what's going to happen if we can top up our funding. Funding will be crucial to demonstrate we can go the distance.

 

[protoje]

Personally think this is what's going to happen if we can top up our funding. Funding will be crucial to demonstrate we can go the distance.

Yeah you’re right, funding is an issue.

 

[Doc]

Cant we appeal to the Australian Government to help protect ownership of this critical mineral resource?
I mean they (FIRB) happy to tell us who can and cant buy into the company so help us out with some legal aid ffs

 

[Dazmac66]

Cant we appeal to the Australian Government to help protect ownership of this critical mineral resource?
I mean they (FIRB) happy to tell us who can and cant buy into the company so help us out with some legal aid ffs

This has been raised many times here doc. The Ambassador in Zimbabwe has even visited the DRC and spoken to Rolex boy and we have heard fuck all from her regarding our situation. Australian government has no right to interfere with the sale of Manono if it comes to that.
It still baffles me how little international coverage this debacle receives considering what is at stake.

 

[robface]

Cant we appeal to the Australian Government to help protect ownership of this critical mineral resource?
I mean they (FIRB) happy to tell us who can and cant buy into the company so help us out with some legal aid ffs

Government decided to act tough then put it in the too hard basket. Tag them, email and question them.
Deboss only one with a response....15 minute phone call and his favourite government agency. Too bad he won't discuss details.

 

[Point Piper Dealer]

I think many of you don't understand how ICSID works. We received ICSID interim orders on the 18th Jan. AVZ then has 7 days to review and agree to the terms and them the DRC govt has a subsequent 7 days after. Once both parties have responded then ICSID will provide the final interim orders.
Remember DRC signed up to ICSID.
ICSID asked AVZ that once permit is returned to AVZ and we receive the ML, will AVZ begin to mine. eg: build plant.

All will will be revealed in the coming weeks I suspect!!

Also don't forget we have the Zijin ICC case orders about to be announced as well.

 

[CHB]

I think many of you don't understand how ICSID works. We received ICSID interim orders on the 18th Jan. AVZ then has 7 days to review and agree to the terms and them the DRC govt has a subsequent 7 days after. Once both parties have responded then ICSID will provide the final interim orders.
Remember DRC signed up to ICSID.
ICSID asked AVZ that once permit is returned to AVZ and we receive the ML, will AVZ begin to mine. eg: build plant.

All will will be revealed in the coming weeks I suspect!!

Also don't forget we have the Zijin ICC case orders about to be announced as well.

In true form, maybe DRC gov will seek an extension and ICSID allow them another 3 months.


Jk

 

[Dazmac66]

I think many of you don't understand how ICSID works. We received ICSID interim orders on the 18th Jan. AVZ then has 7 days to review and agree to the terms and them the DRC govt has a subsequent 7 days after. Once both parties have responded then ICSID will provide the final interim orders.
Remember DRC signed up to ICSID.
ICSID asked AVZ that once permit is returned to AVZ and we receive the ML, will AVZ begin to mine. eg: build plant.

All will will be revealed in the coming weeks I suspect!!

Also don't forget we have the Zijin ICC case orders about to be announced

"I think many of you don't understand how ICSID works"
No shit! I would say 99.95% of us had never heard of it before this shit fight.
Thanks for the explanation though PPD - much appreciated.

 

[Strongman]

I think many of you don't understand how ICSID works. We received ICSID interim orders on the 18th Jan. AVZ then has 7 days to review and agree to the terms and them the DRC govt has a subsequent 7 days after. Once both parties have responded then ICSID will provide the final interim orders.
Remember DRC signed up to ICSID.
ICSID asked AVZ that once permit is returned to AVZ and we receive the ML, will AVZ begin to mine. eg: build plant.

All will will be revealed in the coming weeks I suspect!!

Also don't forget we have the Zijin ICC case orders about to be announced as well.

So assuming we responded in 7 days and DRC has 7 days to respond then that is today. What happens if DRC dont respond ??

 

[Deleted member 2378]

I think many of you don't understand how ICSID works. We received ICSID interim orders on the 18th Jan. AVZ then has 7 days to review and agree to the terms and them the DRC govt has a subsequent 7 days after. Once both parties have responded then ICSID will provide the final interim orders.
Remember DRC signed up to ICSID.
ICSID asked AVZ that once permit is returned to AVZ and we receive the ML, will AVZ begin to mine. eg: build plant.

All will will be revealed in the coming weeks I suspect!!

Also don't forget we have the Zijin ICC case orders about to be announced as well.

Theoretically you are right. But there is a very high chance the DRC will ignore the rulings, they also allowed cominiere to ignore the ICC rulings.
I mean many of us don’t had a clue how the DRC works, it’s a jungle where laws are written on toilet papers to use them like they want.

 

[Carlos Danger]

I think many of you don't understand how ICSID works. We received ICSID interim orders on the 18th Jan. AVZ then has 7 days to review and agree to the terms and them the DRC govt has a subsequent 7 days after. Once both parties have responded then ICSID will provide the final interim orders.
Remember DRC signed up to ICSID.
ICSID asked AVZ that once permit is returned to AVZ and we receive the ML, will AVZ begin to mine. eg: build plant.

All will will be revealed in the coming weeks I suspect!!

Also don't forget we have the Zijin ICC case orders about to be announced as well.

 

[Doc]

View attachment 55702
View attachment 55703

Then I wonder where this 7 days each comes from? I know Jen’s has mentioned it a few times on the bird ( X - whatever ) but from where did he get the info……

 

[PhatCatz]

Government decided to act tough then put it in the too hard basket. Tag them, email and question them.
Deboss only one with a response....15 minute phone call and his favourite government agency. Too bad he won't discuss details.

Yeah doubt Deboss got anything of substance besides standard words. I work for Treasury and whilst not in the Foreign Investment Division that deals with these matters I have scoped out the parliamentary service platform Tsy uses. Nothing on AVZ comes up but I only did a general title search. It would most likely be one of the many that have a title redacted on the system though.

I have worked with FID in a previous role as an advisor for another department and the information that they request and utilise is quite robust. Home Affairs would be the appropriate department to hassle regarding the security of Australian assets in particular with regards to the dodgy dealings of MMGA stooges. DFAT as well for obvious reasons. So hassle these guys and with good info it could influence the decision makers in those departments.

The way these FIRBs are worked is with input from other government agencies which FID within TSY generally take on face value. At least that was my experience working with FID a few years ago.

No doubt the AVZ case would be a high priority for FIRB and discussions would have been had across portfolios at least at the SES level and probably the ministerial level.

Need the yanks to start making more fuss publicly.

 

[Carlos Danger]

Then I wonder where this 7 days each comes from? I know Jen’s has mentioned it a few times on the bird ( X - whatever ) but from where did he get the info……

 

[Xerof]

Then I wonder where this 7 days each comes from? I know Jen’s has mentioned it a few times on the bird ( X - whatever ) but from where did he get the info……

I originally mentioned it in the context of what the process is, as set out by previous similar cases - there is always the requirement for responses from both parties to the preliminary interim orders. Once submitted they will review and issue the final interim orders

Not sure where the 7 and 14 days came from, but my current understanding is that its about now, give or take a day or two, that both parties have to respond.

So final interim orders late next week, perhaps, maybe, possibly?

 

[Manook]

Has Digoil received anything yet?

 

[Xerof]

Has Digoil received anything yet?

Has AVZ asked for any money yet?

 

[Deleted member 2378]

Has Digoil received anything yet?

No

 

[Gmailuser]

No

What’s with this in the know coded talk??

Who is this “Digoil”??

And whilst I think of it, where has Bags disappeared to??