AVZ Discussion 2022

[Bray]

Reckon we could make squillions shorting zinjin now, even better investment than AVZ?

 

[Samus]

You have highlighted exactly the singular issue that is at the heart of the current conundrum....

How do those AVZ "rights" and that Dathcom Shareholders Agreement in actual and legal reality pan out?

Bring on the new day and let's get on with it!

Cheers

Exactly while this graph is somewhat reassuring, it proves nothing relating to the issue at hand.

 

[Sammy_da_Smile]

Can't see any live streams to do with DRC or AVZ as yet at the mining conference. But this channel seems to be doing a fair bit of reporting. There is a live stream from day 1 that was put up, I flicked through it and didn't find anything of interest. Link below for those who wanna have a geez at a recent update. Trying to catch a glimpse of the AVZ stall.

 

[Winenut]

Exactly while this graph is somewhat reassuring, it proves nothing relating to the issue at hand.

 

[CashKing]

imagine after our nasty move down we get an ann, substantial holder Zijin Mining 250million shares aquired and they've also bought Dathomir's 260million shares, now no.1 shareholder with abt 13% of the company, and with CATH's 7% they are combing to own 20% of the company and Zijin will be sitting on the board, and both voting yes for a $1.50 takeover....just stirring the pot,,,gotta have a laugh here n there

and they change our name to AVZijin

They don’t need any more ideas mate…

 

[cruiser51]

Without being negative Nellie I like the clarity and straight-forward sense of the Powerpoint slide

BUT......

It ain't telling us anything we didn't already know

There's nothing in it that provides further evidence that our position is the true and correct and legally defendable position

Like I said I think it's good to maybe enlighten the public a bit and come out with a clear statement....but we already know those facts, the general public doesn't care and the trolls and downrampers will just continue to deny it

I'll be quietly waiting further to see what tomorrow, Mr Market and AVZ bring to the table

The DRC Court structure:
Yes the case wasn't heard in the highest court, but it wasn't heard in the local pub either.
The case was heard in the tribunaux de grande instance.
I really don't know in which court this case was supposed to be heard, I am not a DRC lawyer.

This is a little bit of an explanation:

8.4. The Constitutional Court​

Article 157 of the 2006 Congolese Constitution institutes the Constitutional Court. The government has passed in October 2013 an organic law on the Constitutional Court. Established in 2013, the Constitutional Court became operational in 2015.

8.4.1. Jurisdiction​

The Constitutional Court is the highest court in constitutional matters. It is not the highest court in the DRC but given that the Constitution is the supreme law of the land the Constitutional Court is practically the court defining and settling the most fundamental issues in the country. Moreover, the Court may hear appeals from the Council of State and the Court of Cassation on jurisdictional questions. In that sense, the Constitutional Court performs in the Congo the function that the Tribunal of Conflicts fills in France: deciding within which ordre de jurisdiction or court system a case falls.

The Constitutional Court has a mandate as broad and significant as the Constitution itself. The core function of the Constitutional Court is to check the constitutionality of laws and conduct with legal consequences. Anyone may seize the Court to call into question the constitutionality of an Act of Parliament or regulation. The Court checks the constitutionality of organic laws and regulations before their promulgation. It checks the constitutionality of the rules of order of the Parliament, the Independent Electoral Commission, and the CSAC. Any act the Court finds inconsistent with the Constitution is null and void. The decisions of the Constitutional Court are final and executory and bind all courts and persons in the country.

The Court interprets the Constitution upon request by the President of the Republic, the government, the President of the Senate or the Speaker of the National Assembly, one tenth of the members of either of the two parliamentary houses, Governors, and presidents of provincial assemblies. It resolves disputes on referenda and presidential and legislative elections, conflicts over the distribution of powers between the government and the Parliament and between the central and provincial governments. The Court also hears criminal cases against the President of the Republic and the Prime Minister, after two thirds of the congress vote in favor of prosecution. Upon conviction, the Court removes the President or Prime Minister from his or her office. The International Criminal Court exercises complementary jurisdiction in cases of war crimes and crimes against humanity.

8.4.2. Membership and Tenure​

The Constitutional Court is made up of nine judges appointed by the President of the Republic. The President chooses three judges for appointment as Constitutional Court judges; the congress (i.e., Senate and National Assembly, voting collectively) and the JSC each recommend three Constitutional Court judges. Appointed in July 2014, the first nine judges of the Constitutional Court were Eugène Lwape Banyaku, Jean-Louis Kangashe Esambo, Yvon Kele Oma Kalonda, Noël Ngozi Mala Kilomba, Luamba Bindu, Emmanuel-Janvier Bambi Lessa Luzolo, Mpunga Sungu, Félix Vunduawe Te Pemako, and Corneille Nsongo Wasenda.

Two thirds of the judges must be lawyers from the bench, the bar or academia, with at least 15 years of experience in law or politics. Constitutional Court judges serve for a non-renewable term of nine years. One third of the Court is renewed every three years. Judges choose who among them will be the Chief Justice. Once elected by his peers, the Chief Justice is formally elevated to the position of Chief Justice by the Congolese President by means of an ordinance. The Chief Justice serves for a once renewable term of three years. The current Chief Justice is Benoît Bindu Luamba.

8.5. The Court of Cassation​

Article 153 of the Constitution creates the Court of Cassation (Cour de cassation) and puts civil and military courts under its control. Stated differently, the ordinary court system is headed by the Court of Cassation. In April 2013, the Congolese Parliament passed an organic law on the ordinary court system, which is the vast private and criminal law court system that encompasses the magistrates’ courts (tribunaux de paix), military courts, the Tribunal de Grande Instance, commercial courts, Courts of Appeals, the Military High Court and the Court of Cassation. Ordinary courts mediate the extensive range of civil and criminal litigation; they are the heart of the judicial system.

The Court of Cassation is composed of one “first president” or chief judge (Premier président), associate justices (présidents), and advisors (conseillers). Jérôme Kimpele Kitoko serves as the President of the Court of Cassation. The Court of Cassation is divided in four chambers: one chamber for civil matters, another for commercial matters, a third chamber for social matters and a fourth one for criminal matters. Each chamber has five members. The Parliament signed legislation on the procedure before the Court of Cassation in February 2013.

The Court of Cassation is the court of last resort. It hears appeals from decisions and judgments made by civil and military courts and tribunals. Yet when a case is appealed to the Court of Cassation, the Court does not decide the case itself; it decides only the legal questions referred to it. The Court either upholds the decision from a lower court or quashes it; in such event the Court will remand the case for reconsideration to the lower court in the light of the Court of Cassation’s decision on the legal questions.

One exception exists, though. The Court of Cassation has original and appellate jurisdictions in criminal cases against senior government officers. It decides both the facts and the legal question(s) in criminal cases against members of Parliament, government members other than the Prime Minister, members of the Constitutional Court, judges of the Court of Cassation and prosecutors appearing before that Court, members of the Council of State and prosecutors appearing before the Council, members of the Court des Comptes and prosecutors appearing before that Court, the chief judges of courts of appeals and the prosecutors appearing before those courts, the chief judges of administrative courts of appeals and the prosecutors appearing before those courts, the Governors and vice-governors, provincial ministers, and the presidents of provincial assemblies.

8.6. The Council of State​

Article 154 of the Constitution unfolds a system of administrative courts, formed by the Council of State (Conseil d’État), the Administrative Court of Appeals, administrative courts and tribunals. Unlike the Council of State in France, the Council of State in the DRC is part of the judiciary, not part of the executive branch of government. The Congolese Council of State hears and determines cases brought against the acts, regulations and decisions of national administrative bodies and officials. It hears appeals against decisions of administrative courts of appeals. In instances where there are no competent courts to hear claims for damages caused by measures taken or ordered by the state, the Council adjudicates. It bases its decisions on equity taking into account all circumstances relevant to the parties. Félix Vunduawe Te Pemako is the President of the Council.

8.7. Special Courts​

8.7.1. Commercial Courts​

A 2001 law establishes commercial courts in the Congo. Situated within a Tribunal de Grande Instance, a commercial court (tribunal de commerce) bench is composed of three persons: one permanent judge (appointed by the minister responsible for the administration of justice) and two businesspersons acting as lay judges, although the judge presides over the court. Commercial courts sit in judgment of cases involving bankruptcy, partnerships, unfair competition and commercial papers.

This is the website:

GlobaLex - Open access electronic legal publication dedicated to international, comparative, and foreign law research.

GlobaLex | NYU Law School

www.nyulawglobal.org

 

[Sammy_da_Smile]

Just saw on twitter. Not sure what it means though?

Source - https://www.election-net.com/articl...ete-d-etat-cominiere-sa#.YnomeAlmHr8.whatsapp


DRC/MINES: ACAJ DENOUNCES THE SELLING OFF OF THE MINING ASSETS OF THE STATE-OWNED COMPANY COMINIERE SA
Lievin Luzolo 10 May, 2022 08:45 am

ACAJ denounces the selling off of the mining assets of the state-owned company COMINIERE SA relating to the Manono Lithium deposits.

the NGO directed by Le Georges Kapiamba asks, for this purpose, to the Government, to require the revisitation of the contract of Jont-Venture DATHCOM.

Below is the full letter from ACAJ addressed to the Minister of Mines, sent to ELECTION-NET.COM on Tuesday, May 10.

 

[Sammy_da_Smile]

Wouldn't let me upload these above.

 

[Sammy_da_Smile]

Shit does that say suspend PE?

 

[Costi]

Great find Sammy, if this is legit this looks promising!

 

[Mickdavo]

Shit does that say suspend PE?

Google translate has it as suspend the PE to conduct an independent investigation..

 

[Winenut]

The DRC Court structure:
Yes the case wasn't heard in the highest court, but it wasn't heard in the local pub either.
The case was heard in the tribunaux de grande instance.
I really don't know in which court this case was supposed to be heard, I am not a DRC lawyer.

This is a little bit of an explanation:

8.4. The Constitutional Court​

Article 157 of the 2006 Congolese Constitution institutes the Constitutional Court. The government has passed in October 2013 an organic law on the Constitutional Court. Established in 2013, the Constitutional Court became operational in 2015.

8.4.1. Jurisdiction​

The Constitutional Court is the highest court in constitutional matters. It is not the highest court in the DRC but given that the Constitution is the supreme law of the land the Constitutional Court is practically the court defining and settling the most fundamental issues in the country. Moreover, the Court may hear appeals from the Council of State and the Court of Cassation on jurisdictional questions. In that sense, the Constitutional Court performs in the Congo the function that the Tribunal of Conflicts fills in France: deciding within which ordre de jurisdiction or court system a case falls.

The Constitutional Court has a mandate as broad and significant as the Constitution itself. The core function of the Constitutional Court is to check the constitutionality of laws and conduct with legal consequences. Anyone may seize the Court to call into question the constitutionality of an Act of Parliament or regulation. The Court checks the constitutionality of organic laws and regulations before their promulgation. It checks the constitutionality of the rules of order of the Parliament, the Independent Electoral Commission, and the CSAC. Any act the Court finds inconsistent with the Constitution is null and void. The decisions of the Constitutional Court are final and executory and bind all courts and persons in the country.

The Court interprets the Constitution upon request by the President of the Republic, the government, the President of the Senate or the Speaker of the National Assembly, one tenth of the members of either of the two parliamentary houses, Governors, and presidents of provincial assemblies. It resolves disputes on referenda and presidential and legislative elections, conflicts over the distribution of powers between the government and the Parliament and between the central and provincial governments. The Court also hears criminal cases against the President of the Republic and the Prime Minister, after two thirds of the congress vote in favor of prosecution. Upon conviction, the Court removes the President or Prime Minister from his or her office. The International Criminal Court exercises complementary jurisdiction in cases of war crimes and crimes against humanity.

8.4.2. Membership and Tenure​

The Constitutional Court is made up of nine judges appointed by the President of the Republic. The President chooses three judges for appointment as Constitutional Court judges; the congress (i.e., Senate and National Assembly, voting collectively) and the JSC each recommend three Constitutional Court judges. Appointed in July 2014, the first nine judges of the Constitutional Court were Eugène Lwape Banyaku, Jean-Louis Kangashe Esambo, Yvon Kele Oma Kalonda, Noël Ngozi Mala Kilomba, Luamba Bindu, Emmanuel-Janvier Bambi Lessa Luzolo, Mpunga Sungu, Félix Vunduawe Te Pemako, and Corneille Nsongo Wasenda.

Two thirds of the judges must be lawyers from the bench, the bar or academia, with at least 15 years of experience in law or politics. Constitutional Court judges serve for a non-renewable term of nine years. One third of the Court is renewed every three years. Judges choose who among them will be the Chief Justice. Once elected by his peers, the Chief Justice is formally elevated to the position of Chief Justice by the Congolese President by means of an ordinance. The Chief Justice serves for a once renewable term of three years. The current Chief Justice is Benoît Bindu Luamba.

8.5. The Court of Cassation​

Article 153 of the Constitution creates the Court of Cassation (Cour de cassation) and puts civil and military courts under its control. Stated differently, the ordinary court system is headed by the Court of Cassation. In April 2013, the Congolese Parliament passed an organic law on the ordinary court system, which is the vast private and criminal law court system that encompasses the magistrates’ courts (tribunaux de paix), military courts, the Tribunal de Grande Instance, commercial courts, Courts of Appeals, the Military High Court and the Court of Cassation. Ordinary courts mediate the extensive range of civil and criminal litigation; they are the heart of the judicial system.

The Court of Cassation is composed of one “first president” or chief judge (Premier président), associate justices (présidents), and advisors (conseillers). Jérôme Kimpele Kitoko serves as the President of the Court of Cassation. The Court of Cassation is divided in four chambers: one chamber for civil matters, another for commercial matters, a third chamber for social matters and a fourth one for criminal matters. Each chamber has five members. The Parliament signed legislation on the procedure before the Court of Cassation in February 2013.

The Court of Cassation is the court of last resort. It hears appeals from decisions and judgments made by civil and military courts and tribunals. Yet when a case is appealed to the Court of Cassation, the Court does not decide the case itself; it decides only the legal questions referred to it. The Court either upholds the decision from a lower court or quashes it; in such event the Court will remand the case for reconsideration to the lower court in the light of the Court of Cassation’s decision on the legal questions.

One exception exists, though. The Court of Cassation has original and appellate jurisdictions in criminal cases against senior government officers. It decides both the facts and the legal question(s) in criminal cases against members of Parliament, government members other than the Prime Minister, members of the Constitutional Court, judges of the Court of Cassation and prosecutors appearing before that Court, members of the Council of State and prosecutors appearing before the Council, members of the Court des Comptes and prosecutors appearing before that Court, the chief judges of courts of appeals and the prosecutors appearing before those courts, the chief judges of administrative courts of appeals and the prosecutors appearing before those courts, the Governors and vice-governors, provincial ministers, and the presidents of provincial assemblies.

8.6. The Council of State​

Article 154 of the Constitution unfolds a system of administrative courts, formed by the Council of State (Conseil d’État), the Administrative Court of Appeals, administrative courts and tribunals. Unlike the Council of State in France, the Council of State in the DRC is part of the judiciary, not part of the executive branch of government. The Congolese Council of State hears and determines cases brought against the acts, regulations and decisions of national administrative bodies and officials. It hears appeals against decisions of administrative courts of appeals. In instances where there are no competent courts to hear claims for damages caused by measures taken or ordered by the state, the Council adjudicates. It bases its decisions on equity taking into account all circumstances relevant to the parties. Félix Vunduawe Te Pemako is the President of the Council.

8.7. Special Courts​

8.7.1. Commercial Courts​

A 2001 law establishes commercial courts in the Congo. Situated within a Tribunal de Grande Instance, a commercial court (tribunal de commerce) bench is composed of three persons: one permanent judge (appointed by the minister responsible for the administration of justice) and two businesspersons acting as lay judges, although the judge presides over the court. Commercial courts sit in judgment of cases involving bankruptcy, partnerships, unfair competition and commercial papers.

This is the website:

GlobaLex - Open access electronic legal publication dedicated to international, comparative, and foreign law research.

GlobaLex | NYU Law School

www.nyulawglobal.org

View attachment 6153

Hey Cruiser

I really appreciate the response and the court structure info

Cheers for that

I'm not attesting to the validity or invalidity of any previous decisions or the court that they were presided under

I'm just saying the presentation posted in the announcement didn't provide any additional support or information as to the corporate or legal position than we already understood to be the truth

I'm just keen to get further definitive announcements and information from AVZ, the DRC Govt, Felix himself, the Court Docs and legal details of the terms of the AVZ 15% pre-emptive rights on the Cominiere holding etc etc

Tomorrow will shed some more light I'm sure and I look forward to that

Definitely hoping for solid news, clarity and good outcomes for AVZ holders, Felix Tshisekedi's Govt and the people of the DRC

Cheers!

 

[Costi]

Shit does that say suspend PE?

 

[Scoota30]

Starting to get very spicy....

 

[Freehold]

Shit does that say suspend PE?

.

 

[Costi]

Zijin seem to have done this many times before

 

[Winenut]

Great find Sammy, if this is legit this looks promising!

Ummm

I don't know about that being promising necessarily

That seems to be the Mining permit "Permit de Exploitation" for Dathcom being questioned

My French is merde so I don't know if that query is because of underhand Zijin dealings and dodgy officials or a bigger issue for Dathcom (Read AVZ) with regard to the ML

Anyone else more versed in French and the ins and outs of DRC mining bureaucracy are welcome to step in about now......

 

[investinvest]

The ACAJ is a NGO so I don't think they have much bearing on government decisions.

 

[BEISHA]

Zijin seem to have done this many times before

Far out, this Zijin entity really needs something like this.....

ooops, there is that female connotation again..........does anyone take offence ?

I hope not, Zijin has it coming.

 

[BEISHA]

Ummm

I don't know about that being promising necessarily

That seems to be the Mining permit "Permit de Exploitation" for Dathcom being questioned

My French is merde so I don't know if that query is because of underhand Zijin dealings and dodgy officials or a bigger issue for Dathcom (Read AVZ) with regard to the ML

Anyone else more versed in French and the ins and outs of DRC mining bureacracy are welcome to step in about now......

It looks like scrambled eggs, in fact, my head is scrambled eggs, I will leave it up to Nige to " spreche die English " tomorrow.

Good luck all for a positive result.

Going to watch Master chef.................lol