AVZ Discussion 2022

[obe wan]

It's too politically risky for Felix to have Zijin involved in Manono right now considering the IGF report and heat from the gringos. More likely they will be given a pathway to buy into the project at a later date. Easiest way to do that is through buying out AJN to acquire the north that Dathcom waived after the DFS is complete imo
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Can’t see the north going to AJN , just my opinion ; MoM pulled the decree , basically used Cominieres letter issued Dec 22 where they claimed that AVZ agreed to renounce the north without agreeing this with Cominierie.

MoM canceled the spilt and it now falls back under Dathcom ; if MoM felt that Cominieres beef was AVZ letting north go ; then why would she give it away to AJN?

Canceling the decree and pulling it back in line with the mining code is good and will be recorded that way I.e in line with code . Dicing it and flicking it to AJN .. well that’s just putting it back into the ‘against mining code’ heap again …. I’d be very surprised it that Congo resources / AJN JV isn’t being put under the microscope , AJN isn’t exactly by any means reputable in the DRC and has really potential of being the source of many an irregular deal within the DRC mining industry , Klaus doesn’t give two hoots about locals , shareholders or any one, who’s name isn’t Eckhof

 

[ptlas]

Can’t see the north going to AJN , just my opinion ; MoM pulled the decree , basically used Cominieres letter issued Dec 22 where they claimed that AVZ agreed to renounce the north without agreeing this with Cominierie.

MoM canceled the spilt and it now falls back under Dathcom ; if MoM felt that Cominieres beef was AVZ letting north go ; then why would she give it away to AJN?

Canceling the decree and pulling it back in line with the mining code is good and will be recorded that way I.e in line with code . Dicing it and flicking it to AJN .. well that’s just putting it back into the ‘against mining code’ heap again …. I’d be very surprised it that Congo resources / AJN JV isn’t being put under the microscope , AJN isn’t exactly by any means reputable in the DRC and has really potential of being the source of many an irregular deal within the DRC mining industry , Klaus doesn’t give two hoots about locals , shareholders or any one, who’s name isn’t Eckhof

Generally agree and gave you a TU.

However, if the intention was to flick it to AJN then I think a 'suitable' period of time would be allowed to make the two events (AVZ's loss and AJN's gain) appear unrelated.

I would add that I share your opinion but would not rule out the above scenario.

 

[John25]

Can’t see the north going to AJN , just my opinion ; MoM pulled the decree , basically used Cominieres letter issued Dec 22 where they claimed that AVZ agreed to renounce the north without agreeing this with Cominierie.

MoM canceled the spilt and it now falls back under Dathcom ; if MoM felt that Cominieres beef was AVZ letting north go ; then why would she give it away to AJN?

Canceling the decree and pulling it back in line with the mining code is good and will be recorded that way I.e in line with code . Dicing it and flicking it to AJN .. well that’s just putting it back into the ‘against mining code’ heap again …. I’d be very surprised it that Congo resources / AJN JV isn’t being put under the microscope , AJN isn’t exactly by any means reputable in the DRC and has really potential of being the source of many an irregular deal within the DRC mining industry , Klaus doesn’t give two hoots about locals , shareholders or any one, who’s name isn’t Eckhof

Plus who owns almost 10 million shares in this company …but its not a conflict of interest but there again …”it non of our business” …A win/win …

 

[ptlas]

Plus who owns almost 10 million shares in this company …but its not a conflict of interest but there again …”it non of our business” …A win/win …

Win/ win
Or
Wink/wink?

 

[Carlos Danger]

Can’t see the north going to AJN , just my opinion ; MoM pulled the decree , basically used Cominieres letter issued Dec 22 where they claimed that AVZ agreed to renounce the north without agreeing this with Cominierie.

MoM canceled the spilt and it now falls back under Dathcom ; if MoM felt that Cominieres beef was AVZ letting north go ; then why would she give it away to AJN?

Canceling the decree and pulling it back in line with the mining code is good and will be recorded that way I.e in line with code . Dicing it and flicking it to AJN .. well that’s just putting it back into the ‘against mining code’ heap again …. I’d be very surprised it that Congo resources / AJN JV isn’t being put under the microscope , AJN isn’t exactly by any means reputable in the DRC and has really potential of being the source of many an irregular deal within the DRC mining industry , Klaus doesn’t give two hoots about locals , shareholders or any one, who’s name isn’t Eckhof

Yeah but this time it will be done with Dathcom's explicit approval that they waive the north as a PR or we don't get the PE for the south. Also keeps Zijin happy to drop their claim on the 15% of Dathcom if given the guarantee by Klaus of a buyout price down the line.

The DRC government will end up owning 60% of AJN. Any buyout by Zijin will still include the DRC government at 60%. It's a better deal for them and they maintain control of half the resource for their battery plants. So the state ends up holding at least 10% of RD and 60% of CDL instead of 10% of the whole tenement.

The MoM didn't cite the mining code which leaves the door open to the tenement still being partitioned in the future. If Dathcom were going to be involved with any potential JV in the north we would have already done so. The DRC government want a bigger slice of the pie and are going to use AVZ management's mistake of agreeing to the split to bully them into accepting it imo

Maybe I'm wrong. But if something like this is on the table I would 100% accept it at this stage. I'm more than happy to give up the north to a state controlled entity if it means moving forward on RD as a PE with AVZ holding at least 51% of Dathcom and avoiding the ICC. With or without Nigel as MD. He can always stay on as a 'consultant' like he is currently listed in short term employees under the management remunerations section of AVZ's annual report.

 

[Charbella]

Yeah but this time it will be done with Dathcom's explicit approval that they waive the north as a PR or we don't get the PE for the south. Also keeps Zijin happy to drop their claim on the 15% of Dathcom if given the guarantee by Klaus of a buyout price down the line.

The DRC government will end up owning 60% of AJN. Any buyout by Zijin will still include the DRC government at 60%. It's a better deal for them and they maintain control of half the resource for their battery plants. So the state ends up holding at least 10% of RD and 60% of CDL instead of 10% of the whole tenement.

The MoM didn't cite the mining code which leaves the door open to the tenement still being partitioned in the future. If Dathcom were going to be involved with any potential JV in the north we would have already done so. The DRC government want a bigger slice of the pie and are going to use AVZ management's mistake of agreeing to the split to bully them into accepting it imo

Maybe I'm wrong. But if something like this is on the table I would 100% accept it at this stage. I'm more than happy to give up the north to a state controlled entity if it means moving forward on RD as a PE with AVZ holding at least 51% of Dathcom and avoiding the ICC. With or without Nigel as MD. He can always stay on as a 'consultant' like he is currently listed in short term employees under the management remunerations section of AVZ's annual report.

51% of only the South? Are you kidding me.
As we stand we currently have 60% of both North and South. Not including the 15% of Dathomir. How do we get to only 51% of the South?

 

[Carlos Danger]

51% of only the South? Are you kidding me.

I think we will get 60% of the south

Hope I'm wrong but if it's that or the DRC government seize the whole tenement and we have to spend years at the ICC I would accept it

Or take anything over 1.50 to go away

 

[ptlas]

Yeah but this time it will be done with Dathcom's explicit approval that they waive the north as a PR or we don't get the PE for the south. Also keeps Zijin happy to drop their claim on the 15% of Dathcom if given the guarantee by Klaus of a buyout price down the line.

The DRC government will end up owning 60% of AJN. Any buyout by Zijin will still include the DRC government at 60%. It's a better deal for them and they maintain control of half the resource for their battery plants. So the state ends up holding at least 10% of RD and 60% of CDL instead of 10% of the whole tenement.

The MoM didn't cite the mining code which leaves the door open to the tenement still being partitioned in the future. If Dathcom were going to be involved with any potential JV in the north we would have already done so. The DRC government want a bigger slice of the pie and are going to use AVZ management's mistake of agreeing to the split to bully them into accepting it imo

Maybe I'm wrong. But if something like this is on the table I would 100% accept it at this stage. I'm more than happy to give up the north to a state controlled entity if it means moving forward on RD as a PE with AVZ holding at least 51% of Dathcom and avoiding the ICC. With or without Nigel as MD. He can always stay on as a 'consultant' like he is currently listed in short term employees under the management remunerations section of AVZ's annual report.

Nobody can be trusted at any level.
What appears to be on the table may well turn out to be a magician's card trick.
Z would still be trying to fuck us over and Fatty would probably let them.
AJN would be going to mine and AVZ/RD would be in DRC' s sights.

 

[Carlos Danger]

Nobody can be trusted at any level.
What appears to be on the table may well turn out to be a magician's card trick.
Z would still be trying to fuck us over and Fatty would probably let them.
AJN would be going to mine and AVZ/RD would be in DRC' s sights.

Yeah I 100% agree. I've backed the bod fighting for our rights all the way. But the DRC government has a shit tonne of leverage on us right now and I reckon they have decided to safeguard supply for their battery plants by controlling CDL.

Maybe the north JV won't be with AJN. Could be with someone else. Possibly the gringos.

 

[Samus]

Problem is there is too much rampant speculation, this is where management need to keep shareholders in the loop to a greater extent imo. I'd assume something similar to @obe wan above but it'd be nice to have a position confirmed officially from management.
I'd hope they give us a report soon based on the factual details surrounding the situation once those details are established.
Not holding my breath after the past 10 months though.

 

[Samus]

Yeah I 100% agree. I've backed the bod fighting for our rights all the way. But the DRC government has a shit tonne of leverage on us right now and I reckon they have decided to safeguard supply for their battery plants by controlling CDL.

Maybe the north JV won't be with AJN. Could be with someone else. Possibly the gringos.

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Just as likely they've backed down on the north because the split goes against their mining code and the Presidents wishes.
They aren't going to admit to any of that of course.
We need some clarity before making too many assumptions.

 

[TDITD]

It's too politically risky for Felix to have Zijin involved in Manono right now considering the IGF report and heat from the gringos. More likely they will be given a pathway to buy into the project at a later date. Easiest way to do that is through buying out AJN to acquire the north that Dathcom waived after the DFS is complete imo
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It does seem as if wires were crossed or MOM has not yet been captured by the Chinese $$.

I still believe that The Scummy German was in league with Mupande to give away the ‘Northern’ portion away to AJN and a deal had already been verbally agreed to sell it off to Zijin. He was the only one in for Manono ‘north’ practically before the split even happened so fkn obvious.

But Antoinette cancelled the decrees, which she would not have done so if she had recently been captured by Zijin/Chinese. This has thrown a spanner in Klaus and Mupandes plans.
Unless of course Zijin believe they can now capture the whole prize (greedy Chinese, never!)

PR13559 Cannot be just taken off of us, that would be disastrous for Felix’s world tour declaring DRC open for business. So that’s AJN out Klaus gone,but he won’t stop weaseling

But Zijin these are the gold standard fucktards. They apparently pulled out after being caught out by IGF, they deliberately paid far less as they didn’t want to actually pay market price, illegally and Cominiere denied our ROFR.

They own nothing right now, but have thrown so much mud even our own holders, smart holders, level-headed holders, astute and good people are confused as to who owns what and saying we need to negotiate with IGF reported Criminals. They hold nothing, Cominiere do.

Our fight seems to be with Cominiere, who it appears Zijin are using as a proxy. It’s amusing Cominiere have said nothing about their dealings with Zijin, yet they are so against us who have furthered the project without them lifting a hand and so into the bribe laden Chinese. Is gifting an epipen a bribe ?

A meeting together with MOM, Felix & where we tell him directly of our plan for that 15% and offer of percentage in AVZ. We can then ask him if we offer that to Cominiere who IGF have correctly caught out as criminals and that $$ will go missing, OR do we offer that directly to the state who will decide for Cominiere.

If we can bypass Cominiere and enter into negotiations directly with DRC for the 15%, the state profits not the criminals oops I meant Cominiere (same same) and we can finally get moving.

Is this what we are looking to do right now?

 

[Onthefm]

Yeah but this time it will be done with Dathcom's explicit approval that they waive the north as a PR or we don't get the PE for the south. Also keeps Zijin happy to drop their claim on the 15% of Dathcom if given the guarantee by Klaus of a buyout price down the line.

The DRC government will end up owning 60% of AJN. Any buyout by Zijin will still include the DRC government at 60%. It's a better deal for them and they maintain control of half the resource for their battery plants. So the state ends up holding at least 10% of RD and 60% of CDL instead of 10% of the whole tenement.

The MoM didn't cite the mining code which leaves the door open to the tenement still being partitioned in the future. If Dathcom were going to be involved with any potential JV in the north we would have already done so. The DRC government want a bigger slice of the pie and are going to use AVZ management's mistake of agreeing to the split to bully them into accepting it imo

Maybe I'm wrong. But if something like this is on the table I would 100% accept it at this stage. I'm more than happy to give up the north to a state controlled entity if it means moving forward on RD as a PE with AVZ holding at least 51% of Dathcom and avoiding the ICC. With or without Nigel as MD. He can always stay on as a 'consultant' like he is currently listed in short term employees under the management remunerations section of AVZ's annual report.

Mate you have no need to worry about the nige. He always seems to look after himself exceedingly well.

 

[JNRB]

Yeah I 100% agree. I've backed the bod fighting for our rights all the way. But the DRC government has a shit tonne of leverage on us right now and I reckon they have decided to safeguard supply for their battery plants by controlling CDL.

Maybe the north JV won't be with AJN. Could be with someone else. Possibly the gringos.

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DRC can legislate that extracted resources be processed in-country. They don't have to rely on majority ownership. That would be devestating to foreign investment, as would taking the resource from AVZ.

Also, I believe AVZ's offer for extra % of dathcom involved giving DRC some shares actually in AVZ (can't remember when that was discussed though)

Best and fastest option for DRC to see benefit from Manono is to boot dodgy actors and AVZ to develop. All the issues come from people that are not acting in DRC best interest. They had free reign to do so till now, but it's clear that's no longer the case. Will they push their luck on AVZ at risk of being booted out of their position entirely? It's all our nothing for Zijin maybe, but not all the corrupt ministers. They may give in on fighting avz lest they lose their cushy ministerial jobs

 

[ptlas]

Great discussion, great posts, but I still don't have a bloody clue what is really happening.

As @Sammael says it's time for the board to clarify things. Dead right but we know they almost certainly won't.

Overall, I remain upbeat. The fact that we're still in the game is a huge achievement and the tide is coming in.
Convinced we won't finish with nada but I have no idea how this will pan out.

Chin up chaps/lasses

 

[TDITD]

Yeah but this time it will be done with Dathcom's explicit approval that they waive the north as a PR or we don't get the PE for the south. Also keeps Zijin happy to drop their claim on the 15% of Dathcom if given the guarantee by Klaus of a buyout price down the line.

The DRC government will end up owning 60% of AJN. Any buyout by Zijin will still include the DRC government at 60%. It's a better deal for them and they maintain control of half the resource for their battery plants. So the state ends up holding at least 10% of RD and 60% of CDL instead of 10% of the whole tenement.

The MoM didn't cite the mining code which leaves the door open to the tenement still being partitioned in the future. If Dathcom were going to be involved with any potential JV in the north we would have already done so. The DRC government want a bigger slice of the pie and are going to use AVZ management's mistake of agreeing to the split to bully them into accepting it imo

Maybe I'm wrong. But if something like this is on the table I would 100% accept it at this stage. I'm more than happy to give up the north to a state controlled entity if it means moving forward on RD as a PE with AVZ holding at least 51% of Dathcom and avoiding the ICC. With or without Nigel as MD. He can always stay on as a 'consultant' like he is currently listed in short term employees under the management remunerations section of AVZ's annual report.

This is why we need to be in a room talking with them
Then we can tailor around what they want, “we have Manono ready for construction Felix, we can do the same for CDL in less time, we know this patch like the back of our hands, we have built up some goodwill so lets continue it with CDL, with us as partners you know everything is above board and we will fulfill our duties to the local population in Manono, they want us here and we want to be here”.
If they want more of CDL we can work shit out.
Remember we are offering them shares in AVZ, DRC gets dividends and ownership of a portion of AVZ which will continue to be worth more with expansions and battery plants.
Any deal with us is going to be better optics, better for the people, better for the state…..ffs why is this so hard

 

[DiscoDanNZ]

Great posts people, I've finally managed to catch up here. It just feels like were stuck on a fucken roundabout at the moment though doesn't it...

Heres the live traffic cam of the DRC Manono roundabout, see if you can spot AVZ trying to enter...

 

[Sammy_da_Smile]

My on the ground sauces (tomato) has informed me that the office lights were on all night …we must have someone at head office burning the candle ….Fuck rumours again …its just the AVZ book keeper doing our BoD monthly pays
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[Modo]

I think we will get 60% of the south

Hope I'm wrong but if it's that or the DRC government seize the whole tenement and we have to spend years at the ICC I would accept it

Or take anything over 1.50 to go away

At 78c the market has priced in worse.

If can maintain 60%, do a new deal with CATL, the SP will come good, after a flash sale.

 

[tonster66]

I said months ago on HC, the bad guys are not going away. We remove one hurdle and they put another one in front of us.
Entertain a sale. Negotiations and agreements don't mean much to the bad guys. There would not be any trust if we had to work together.

Totally agree, no trust