AVZ Discussion 2022

[Thaz]

[I will get actual ATO advice on the following question, just asking casually for now]

Thought I'd see if any of you AVZ heads know the answer to this tax question, and I decided to ask in this thread because other investers might be in a similar situation and benefit from any knowledge.

So I purchased many different parcels of AVZ OPTIONS at different times and prices.
I converted all of the options at once (3c each IIRC) before they expired.
Now I know this event began the 12 month holding clock over again, from the time of conversion (back in may 2020), but I'm wondering when it comes time to sell these shares, can I average the cost of all the options I bought, add 3 cents, and treat them all as one big parcel of shares aquired on conversion day, for the purposes of figuring out capital gains?

For example, lets say I bought 100 options at 2 cents, and 100 options at 4 cents at a later time.
Conversion at 3 cents.
Can I just average the 200 total options at 3 cents each, and add the strike cost of 3 cents for a total outlay of 6 cents cost per share for all 200?
Or do I have to treat them as 2 seperate parcels, 100 costing 5 cents, 100 costing 7 cents?

In the first instance, if I were to sell 150 of these shares, it's a simple calculation and easy to keep track of what's left over.
But if it's the second case, I'd have to calculate 2 seperate capital gains events, one for one parcel, and one for half of the other parcel.

I hope that makes sense, and please, again, when the time comes, I WILL ask the ATO.

Cheers.

LIke money bags mentioned - you can't average the cost base of the shares across different parcels.

However, the ATO allows for you to specifically choose the parcels of shares for the cost bases that you wish to use in order to calculate the gain.

So you can, hypothetically, get an averaged cost base from that - however there is much more record keeping required and i've never personally seen any of my clients do this.

When lodging your return - all you need to do is disclose the CGT disclosures on your ITR (gross gain/loss/discount applied, proceeds/cost base, etc). i.e. this can be disclosed as the one line item.

If the ATO requests details on how you calculated this - then you would need to provide them workings of the cost base

I've used sharesight previously and i find that it is quite useful in assisting you in maintaining these recordsand calculating the net capital gain.

 

[Scoota30]

On a thread where MMM said "soon" on 20/10/2022.
Jens tends to go out in a limb on these things.
Once 15 times bitten, twice shy...

Agreed, the only twitter post any of us should get excited by is the official AVZ account stating that we have received the ML with a link to an official ASX announcement.

 

[TDITD]

On a thread where MMM said "soon" on 20/10/2022.
Jens tends to go out in a limb on these things.
Once 15 times bitten, twice shy...

To be fair if he was using DRC talk like ol Nige has a penchant for then, “around the corner” well that’s a solid six months in DRC talk

 

[BenGriffo]

Hi @MoneyBags1348 and @Thaz (and @Azzler)

Agree with your comments when staying within the same stock and dealing with just heads or just options.

However when converting options to heads, my experience is that you can take the average buy-in of the options, add the strike/exercise price and that becomes the new buy-in for that set of heads. The new liquidity event bundles them together and mathematically adding the diff quantities and buy-in prices of all your option purchases then dividing by the total number to convert is ultimately the average price.

If you let the options lapse you book that as a lose, but if you convert you bring across the avg buy-in to the heads (or the books don't balance).

Probably a few ways to deal with it. I'm not an accountant but that is what my accountant did while talking to the ATO.

 

[Mr Inappropriate]

View attachment 26594

Interesting that constantin has jumped in - he normally stays outside the fray.

I just wanted to post this picture for the Rudd / Gillard vibes…

 

[Hemicuda]

Interesting that constantin has jumped in - he normally stays outside the fray.

I just wanted to post this picture for the Rudd / Gillard vibes…

Another round of false hope on the way no doubt, looks like some ministerial flatulence by the looks.

 

[j.l]

Another round of false hope on the way no doubt, looks like some ministerial flatulence by the looks.

Haha, beat me to it!

 

[Samus]

We will get the notification done.
What the fuck does this even mean?

 

[DiscoDanNZ]

Another round of false hope on the way no doubt, looks like some ministerial flatulence by the looks.

You talking about AVZ/ML in general or people concerned about calculating their CGT like they will be able to sell the shares anytime soon?

P. S. I'm just making light of the situation guys don't take me seriously, after all without humour all we have is a bunch of shares we can't sell.

 

[BenGriffo]

You talking about AVZ/ML in general or people concerned about calculating their CGT like they will be able to sell the shares anytime soon?

P. S. I'm just making light of the situation guys don't take me seriously, after all without humour all we have is a bunch of shares we can't sell.

Bro, what are you talking about? I just xfer to Deeland. They said the money should arrive in a few days…

 

[BEISHA]

MORE CORRUPTION…. OR IS IT JUST OUR STRATEGIC ADVISOR & ATTORNEY
TELLING BULLSHIT​

21/08/2022

View attachment 26570


20/10/2022

View attachment 26573

 

[TDITD]

We will get the notification done.
What the fuck does this even mean?

 

[BRICK]

Interesting that constantin has jumped in - he normally stays outside the fray.

I just wanted to post this picture for the Rudd / Gillard vibes…

Seriously, does she not own any other clothes or have any differnet emotions?

Im begining to think she may be a BOT

 

[JAG]

 

[JAG]

 

[Fletch77]

Could someone please post the AFR story “tea bag me Tommy“ wrote on the Swami case

I can’t get past the pay wall and refuse to give those pricks my money

 

[BRICK]

View attachment 26622

A close friend and client of mine who uses credit suisse brokerage told me yesterday that credit suisse are considering legal action against AFR. will be interesting to see if they actually do something.

 

[The Fox]

Could someone please post the AFR story “tea bag me Tommy“ wrote on the Swami case

I can’t get past the pay wall and refuse to give those pricks my money

There are a few articles, here is one.

This site / link below normally works for AFR paywall.

12ft

Cheers The Fox

‘I’ve won the war’: Stock Swami declares early victory against Kumova
Tom RichardsonMarkets reporter and commentator Dec 19, 2022 – 3.48pm
Save
Share
Defamation defendant Alan Davison used Twitter on Monday to declare that he had won the war against sharemarket entrepreneur Tolga Kumova and the shameless promotion of his stocks by others, despite the fact that Justice Michael Lee has not delivered a verdict in the Federal Court trial between the pair.
Mr Davison – better known by his Twitter profile Stock Swami – also claimed that whatever the outcome of the legal battle, Mr Kumova had destroyed his own reputation as shown by the results of his re-election to Aston Minerals’ board and disregard to comply with his 671b Corporations Act obligations.

Alan Davison, 67, the defendant better known as Stock Swami. Michael Quelch
In response to the online broadside a spokesperson for Mr Kumova said, “Mr Davison continues to make baseless assertions on social media, despite abandoning his truth defence on many of the matters about which he is tweeting. We await the decision of Justice Lee and will be making no further comment until that decision is handed down.”
Vicious battle
Melbourne-based Mr Kumova, 45, sued self-styled citizen journalist Mr Davison, 67, for six allegedly defamatory tweets between 2019 and 2020, which he says accuse him of insider trading, misleading the market, and the provision of inside information about New Century Resources’ failed bid to buy the Goro nickel mine in New Caledonia.

The Twitter barney escalated into a wild Federal Court trial in Sydney in June, which included Mr Davison changing his defence and being ordered by Justice Lee to board a flight from New Zealand to Sydney for cross-examination over claims he repeatedly lied to the court, misled lawyers, hid material, falsified affidavits, and instructed an informant to delete

evidence. In Monday’s online outburst, Mr Davison again attacked the Melbourne-based stock trader for his own alleged deletion of more than 300 tweets and claimed this act justified his social media-based campaign to call Mr Kumova and other stock promoters out. Mr Davison went on to inform about 7800 followers that his fault in the defamation case was to do everything he could to protect the identity of his stockbroker informant named Stephen Dobson, who ultimately betrayed their secret communications over New Century Resources’ plan to bid for the Goro nickel mine. “Everything I tweeted about the Goro deal came from him. It’s noteworthy that [Evan] Cranston & [Patrick] Walta & other Board members of $NCZ at the time are no longer on the board. Dobson betrayed me in the end but my conscience is clear. Anyway I just want this as my record b4 I go away. Merry [Xmas],” Mr Davison tweeted.

On top of a statutory $443,000 cap on general damages in defamation cases, Mr Kumova seeks aggravated damages and claims the Twitter gadfly engaged in a campaign, with a failure to publish an apology or retraction once informed of factual errors in the matters complained of in June 2020. It’s believed Mr Kumova, a former Financial Review Young Rich Lister, may also seek an injunction from a judge to order Mr Davison to stop the online attacks. The legal costs associated with the case focused on the pitfalls of Twitter as a platform for self-promotion are unknown. Internet entrepreneur Mr Davison, a former resident of a spiritual ashram in NSW, has previously said he is self-funding the defence.

Lawyers and representatives for both parties declined to make any additional comment before a verdict that Mr Davison claimed, on Twitter, is likely to be delivered this week. Tom Richardson writes and comments on markets including equities, debt, crypto, software, banking, payments, and regulation. He worked in asset management at Bank of New York Mellon in London. Connect with Tom on Twitter. Email Tom at tom.richardson@afr.com

 

[wombat74]

View attachment 26594

We are paying $$$$ this guy . It's not in his best interest to give out bad news or negative vibes .

 

[Fletch77]

There are a few articles, here is one.

This site / link below normally works for AFR paywall.

12ft

Cheers The Fox

‘I’ve won the war’: Stock Swami declares early victory against Kumova
Tom RichardsonMarkets reporter and commentator Dec 19, 2022 – 3.48pm
Save
Share
Defamation defendant Alan Davison used Twitter on Monday to declare that he had won the war against sharemarket entrepreneur Tolga Kumova and the shameless promotion of his stocks by others, despite the fact that Justice Michael Lee has not delivered a verdict in the Federal Court trial between the pair.
Mr Davison – better known by his Twitter profile Stock Swami – also claimed that whatever the outcome of the legal battle, Mr Kumova had destroyed his own reputation as shown by the results of his re-election to Aston Minerals’ board and disregard to comply with his 671b Corporations Act obligations.
View attachment 26637 View attachment 26636 View attachment 26640
Alan Davison, 67, the defendant better known as Stock Swami. Michael Quelch
In response to the online broadside a spokesperson for Mr Kumova said, “Mr Davison continues to make baseless assertions on social media, despite abandoning his truth defence on many of the matters about which he is tweeting. We await the decision of Justice Lee and will be making no further comment until that decision is handed down.”
Vicious battle
Melbourne-based Mr Kumova, 45, sued self-styled citizen journalist Mr Davison, 67, for six allegedly defamatory tweets between 2019 and 2020, which he says accuse him of insider trading, misleading the market, and the provision of inside information about New Century Resources’ failed bid to buy the Goro nickel mine in New Caledonia.
View attachment 26634

The Twitter barney escalated into a wild Federal Court trial in Sydney in June, which included Mr Davison changing his defence and being ordered by Justice Lee to board a flight from New Zealand to Sydney for cross-examination over claims he repeatedly lied to the court, misled lawyers, hid material, falsified affidavits, and instructed an informant to delete View attachment 26638

evidence. In Monday’s online outburst, Mr Davison again attacked the Melbourne-based stock trader for his own alleged deletion of more than 300 tweets and claimed this act justified his social media-based campaign to call Mr Kumova and other stock promoters out. Mr Davison went on to inform about 7800 followers that his fault in the defamation case was to do everything he could to protect the identity of his stockbroker informant named Stephen Dobson, who ultimately betrayed their secret communications over New Century Resources’ plan to bid for the Goro nickel mine. “Everything I tweeted about the Goro deal came from him. It’s noteworthy that [Evan] Cranston & [Patrick] Walta & other Board members of $NCZ at the time are no longer on the board. Dobson betrayed me in the end but my conscience is clear. Anyway I just want this as my record b4 I go away. Merry [Xmas],” Mr Davison tweeted. View attachment 26635

On top of a statutory $443,000 cap on general damages in defamation cases, Mr Kumova seeks aggravated damages and claims the Twitter gadfly engaged in a campaign, with a failure to publish an apology or retraction once informed of factual errors in the matters complained of in June 2020. It’s believed Mr Kumova, a former Financial Review Young Rich Lister, may also seek an injunction from a judge to order Mr Davison to stop the online attacks. The legal costs associated with the case focused on the pitfalls of Twitter as a platform for self-promotion are unknown. Internet entrepreneur Mr Davison, a former resident of a spiritual ashram in NSW, has previously said he is self-funding the defence.

Lawyers and representatives for both parties declined to make any additional comment before a verdict that Mr Davison claimed, on Twitter, is likely to be delivered this week. Tom Richardson writes and comments on markets including equities, debt, crypto, software, banking, payments, and regulation. He worked in asset management at Bank of New York Mellon in London. Connect with Tom on Twitter. Email Tom at tom.richardson@afr.com View attachment 26639

Thanks Fox