BRN Discussion Ongoing
- Thread starter TechGirl
- Start date
Damo4
Regular
2 options
- Brainchip listened to all the sooks on here over the last few days and said: "yep you're right again, let me just sell something real quick"
- Brainchip was already working with VVDN, ANT61, Renesas Megachips etc and this is BAU, not correlated to the SP
Hey @Damo4 I am so confused with all this that my head is spinning 360. I dont know which one to believe which one to pass lol.
What's everyone's thoughts on competing against existing edge AI boxes from them?Cheaper then other edge boxes. Competes against Nivdia and Qualcom.
BrainChip Engages VVDN to Deliver Industry’s First Commercial Edge Box Based on Neuromorphic Technology
20.09.2023 - BrainChip Holdings Ltd (ASX: BRN, OTCQX: BRCHF, ADR: BCHPY), the world’s first commercial producer of ultra-low power, fully digital, event-based, neuromorphic AI IP, today announced that it has partnered with VVDN Technologies, a premier ...www.google.com
Wasn't there previous comments that the existing technology like these boxes are good enough? So why would industries suddenly switch to Akida?
wilzy123
Founding Member
DollazAndSense
Regular
1) Agreed, we did know about this partnership with VVDN. As Dio has broken down multiple times for us now though (and I personally believe he is correct, yours / others thoughts may differ), these are joint development agreements, meaning a much bigger profit share of the product.Because of two reasons,
1) We already know about this partnership with VVDN.
2) Not announced on ASX, so we are told by BRN, usually that means it is immaterial.
Regarding, the edge box, it is great that it is available for pre-sale, but I will keep an eye on the actual revenue figures to see how many are being sold.
VVDN has operating revenue of 500 crore INR ( approx 100 million AUD) I need to see the size of the piece of pie this edge box can get.
500 Error
www.tofler.in
2) Honestly, I'm not sure how these arrangements aren't going flag to the ASX that they actually are material? Maybe the material value cannot be ascertained at this stage and there is a loophole of sorts in the ASX rules pertaining to joint developments. I'm sure others are more in the know than myself on this issue.
Absolutely, I also err on the conservative side of what revenue this edge box may bring in, at least initially. I understand your disappointment with Brainchip for a good while now and I have also been quite deflated with the business' sales performance. But I have a feeling announcements like these (ASX listed or not), are going to start ramping up before years end.
Last edited:
Well just maybe VVDN thinks the Brainchip box is better.
And who better to compare boxes and spread the word than a box expert, like vVDn
equanimous
Norse clairvoyant shapeshifter goddess
7 Manufactoring centres in India
buena suerte :-)
BOB Bank of Brainchip
Perfectly said my friend ..... I also have total faith in BRN being a game changer and making many of us $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$... It is extremely hard to take this negativity at the moment...But it will turn around (IMO)... Thanks Early...
... Catch up soon hopefully! 
Just one 'Power announcement'!
Hold tight Chippers
buena suerte :-)
BOB Bank of Brainchip
AI_Inquirer
Regular
Just as we were on the brink of launching our 2.0 product for our IP sales-oriented business model, there's a sudden shift towards hardware. We've engaged (so paying) VVDN to produce the product, but now the question is: What will it cost us to manufacture these hardware devices, a product category never previously mentioned by the company? Which will be entering into direct competition with well-established giants (Qualcomm and Nvidia) in this space.
Also, could we potentially undermine our own clients like Renesas and Megachip by introducing a hardware product that might compete with whatever projects or chips they have in the pipeline?
Also, could we potentially undermine our own clients like Renesas and Megachip by introducing a hardware product that might compete with whatever projects or chips they have in the pipeline?
equanimous
Norse clairvoyant shapeshifter goddess
Fullmoonfever
Top 20
Like it but not sure will move the needle too much but...
The key wording for me is that "Brainchip engages VVDN"
Implies to me that maybe we bit the bullet to at least get a working product out there that would prove Akida in the wild and went with VVDN as the most capable with the right sort of mkt product to manufacture.
Could be wrong, but that's how I read the wording.
If so, then may be a reduced downside risk for VVDN as we maybe pay part of the BOM or similar and maybe revenue split slanted more to VVDN favour or entirely (?) especially if there isn't a material ASX Ann advising there is a $ value attached by contract.
Lack of a formal Ann would imply possibly no $ attached as revenue initially. Could be a test the water run and then become more $ formal if successful?
Upside wins are VVDN have the first real commercial / industrial IOT available product with Akida / neuromorphic and for BRN, proves again to be the first with Akida and hopefully generates more interest.
Just my thoughts anyway.
The key wording for me is that "Brainchip engages VVDN"
Implies to me that maybe we bit the bullet to at least get a working product out there that would prove Akida in the wild and went with VVDN as the most capable with the right sort of mkt product to manufacture.
Could be wrong, but that's how I read the wording.
If so, then may be a reduced downside risk for VVDN as we maybe pay part of the BOM or similar and maybe revenue split slanted more to VVDN favour or entirely (?) especially if there isn't a material ASX Ann advising there is a $ value attached by contract.
Lack of a formal Ann would imply possibly no $ attached as revenue initially. Could be a test the water run and then become more $ formal if successful?
Upside wins are VVDN have the first real commercial / industrial IOT available product with Akida / neuromorphic and for BRN, proves again to be the first with Akida and hopefully generates more interest.
Just my thoughts anyway.
TheFunkMachine
seeds have the potential to become trees.
VVDN and brainchip to bring out edge box based on Akida tech and VVDN expertise calling out Nvidia and Qualcomm as not good enough
https://brainchip.com/brainchip-eng...al-edge-box-based-on-neuromorphic-technology/
https://brainchip.com/brainchip-eng...al-edge-box-based-on-neuromorphic-technology/
Frangipani
Regular
Below article confirms the above. What I found particularly intriguing was the paragraph on parametric insurance, which I have marked blue. An application for neuromorphic technology that doesn’t immediately spring to mind, at least not to mine…
Cambridge Consultants (not to be mixed up with now defunct Cambridge Analytica and their data scandal!) are part of Capgemini, a French multinational IT and consulting company, headquartered in Paris, that I personally suspect to be an investor hidden behind one of the nominee accounts, most likely BNP Paribas. Just my gut feeling.
A gentle reminder: Capgemini’s Head of Center of Excellence, Silicon Engineering, Loïc Hamon, moderated a panel at the Munich GSA Executive Forum in mid-June titled “New Silicon Design Paradigms“ with Sean Hehir being one of the panelists, discussing the effects of the “chiplet revolution”. Capgemini were also sponsor and VIP dinner host at said event.
GSA – European Executive Forum
EventReimagining the future of the semiconductor industryat GSA European Executive ForumJune 17-19, 2024 | Munich, Germany FacebookTwitterLinkedin
www.capgemini.com
The High Performance, Low Power Promise of Neuromorphic Computing - Silicon UK Expert Advice
Learn how neuromorphic computing could transform how many enterprises approach their large scale compute needs in the future.
www.silicon.co.uk
The High Performance, Low Power Promise of Neuromorphic Computing
September 20, 2023, 12:17 pm
Society, and in turn business, need to find more sustainable alternatives to the power-hungry computation that has got us to where we are today. I believe it is time to turn for inspiration to the most efficient and powerful computer of all – the human brain. Excitingly, the emergence of neuromorphic computing, which mimics our neural systems, promises both extraordinary performance and transformative energy efficiency.
Before I turn to its wider benefits and potential applications, let me put that energy saving in perspective. Conventional computing technology is based on the so-called von Neumann architecture, where data processing and transfer are carried out intensively and continuously. Next-generation computers are expected to operate at the exascale with 1018 calculations per second. But the downside is power consumption.
Data computation and transfer are responsible for a large part of this consumption, and the rapid development of machine learning and AI neural network models is adding even more demand. As much as 10 megawatts of power could be used for some AI learning algorithms on an exascale computer. Data-centric computing requires a hardware system revolution. The performance of the computing system, in particular the energy efficiency, sets the fundamental limit of AI/ML capability. As for neuromorphic computing? It has the potential to achieve HPC and yet consumes 1/1000th of the energy.
The neuromorphic approach uses silicon artificial neurons to form a spiking neural network (SNN) that performs event-triggered computation. There is a key difference between an SNN and other networks, such as the convolutional neural network (CNN). An SNN is formed by silicon artificial neurons and performs event-triggered computation. Spiking neurons process input information only after the receipt of the incoming spike signal. Spiking neural networks effectively attempt to make the neurons more like real neurons.
The process does not work in discrete time steps. Instead, it takes in events over a time series to help build up signals within the neurons. These signals accumulate inside the neurons until a threshold is passed, at which point it triggers computation operation.
Ultra-low power operation can be achieved thanks to SNNs being effectively in an ‘off’ mode most of the time and only kicking into action when a change, or ‘event’, is detected.
Once in action, it can achieve fast computation without running an energy-consuming fast clock by triggering a huge number of parallel operations (equivalent to 1000s CPU in parallel). So, it consumes only a fraction of the power compared to CPU/GPU for the same workload.
This is why the future of neuromorphic computing is well suited to edge AI – implementing low-power AI on end devices without connecting to the cloud. This is especially so for TinyML applications that tend to focus on battery-operated sensors, IoT devices and so on.
Next-generation neuromorphic systems are expected to have intrinsic capabilities to learn or deal with complex data just as our brain does. It has the potential to process large amounts of digital information with much lower power consumption than conventional processors.
In the medium term, hybrid traditional computers with neuromorphic chips could vastly improve performance over conventional machines. In the longer term, fully neuromorphic computers will be fundamentally different and designed for specific applications, from natural language processing to autonomous driving.
When it comes to design, instead of the conventional architecture of portioning chips into processor and memory, the computer may be built with silicon ‘neurons’ performing both functions.
Building extensive ‘many-to-many’ neuron connectivity will allow an efficient pipeline for signal interaction and facilitate massive parallel operation. There is a trend to develop ever-increasing amounts of electronic neurons, synapses and so on in a single chip.
The design approaches of neuromorphic processor chips broadly follow one of a number of distinct paths. The ASIC-based digital neuromorphic chip offers highly optimised computation performance tailored for application requirements. For AI applications, it can potentially perform both inference and real-time learning.
The FPGA-based chip is similar to ASIC-based digital design but also offers portability and reconfigurability. Due to its highly reconfigurable nature and parallel speed, FPGA is considered to be a suitable platform for mimicking, to some degree, the natural plasticity of biological neural networks.
Analogue neuromorphic chips, which include so-called ‘in-memory-computing’, have the potential to achieve the lowest power consumption. They’d mainly be suited for machine learning inference rather than real-time learning.
The photonic integrated circuit (PIC) based neuromorphic chip offers photonic computation that can achieve very high speed at very low power consumption, while mixed-signal NSoC (Neuromorphic System-on-Chip) design combines extremely low power analogue design for ML inference with digital SNN architecture processor for real-time learning.
I expect that neuromorphic computing will generate development opportunities in several technological areas, such as materials, devices, neuromorphic circuits and new neuromorphic algorithms and software development platforms – all crucial elements for the success of neuromorphic computing.
There are countless potential applications. Applying neuromorphic techniques to vision applications represents a large market opportunity for many different sectors, including smart vision sensors and gesture control applications in smart homes, offices and factories.
Another use case is neuromorphic computing for myoelectric prosthetics control. Myoelectric prosthetics assist people with reduced mobility by sensing and processing muscle spikes. However, inefficiencies must be improved for enhanced user experience, such as increasing the granularity of movement classification and reducing computational resources to decrease energy consumption.
Low-power edge computing represents a key area of high commercial potential. As IoT applications in smart homes, offices, industries and cities proliferate, there is an increasing need for more intelligence on the edge as control is moved from data centres to local devices. Applications such as autonomous robots, wearable healthcare systems, security and IoT all share the common characteristics of battery-operated, ultra-low power, standalone operation.
One potential application that I find particularly fascinating is that of “Parametric Insurance”. With global attention increasingly turning to climate-related issues, this unconventional form of ‘disaster insurance’ is playing an increasingly significant role. It is a product that offers pre-specified pay-outs based on a trigger event – and can help to provide protection when standard policies are harder to get.
For me, the correlation to neuromorphic computing is clear. Parametric Insurance can be tied to a catastrophe bond (CAT) for events such as hurricanes, earthquakes and so on. Neuromorphic powered edge computing has a big role to play as it would allow for very granular and sophisticated risk analysis, adjudication, and payment settlement. All would be at the edge – with an associated low cost.
About the author
Dr Aidong Xu, Head of Semiconductor Capability, Cambridge Consultants
Aidong holds over 30 years of experience across diverse industries, including with some of the leading semiconductor companies. He has managed large internationally based engineering teams and brought innovative industry-leading products into the global market that have achieved rapid and sustained business growth. Aidong holds a PhD. in Power electronics and Power semiconductors.
Hold tight, I believe that things will.....Perfectly said my friend ..... I also have total faith in BRN being a game changer and making many of us $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$... It is extremely hard to take this negativity at the moment...But it will turn around (IMO)... Thanks Early...
Just one 'Power announcement'!
Hold tight Chippers
I will tell you what I believe. As a SH we have the right to start questioning the company and everything they do. It listed to get funds to support their possible venture into the ASX and to change the world. Well good on them for trying.
Not sure who have seen Elon Musk's documentary but he was so close to financial ruin it's not funny. The roadster was pre ordered and was having problems and delays. At the meeting for pre orders people found out they had to pay 20% (?) extra for their cars, there was all hell to pay. His darkest days, but he stood up and flourished.
Brainchip management and some posters here can blame Covid and Ukraine as much as they like. I run a business for International students. Covid killed the business down 97% for 2 years. We are back to 2014-6 levels and doing well. We had to work hard to turn the market around, and we are seeing amazing results for our efforts.
I suppose what I'm saying is I no longer want to here reasons why not, I want to see results. I'm on the edge of a cliff ready to jump ship, turning from a believer into a slight sceptic. We'll see how the company responds to this attack on the SP. Sorry but they SP will do what the SP does, is not looking after SH. That attitude is, I'll get paid no matter what, and I'll get my bonuses, so SP doesn't matter. Well I'll tell you now, it matters to me.
(The difference between being in the green and Red i suppose, I'm sure many are worse off than me, a lot worse).
Vladsblood
Regular
Agree, Now TSX is very similar to the ol' Hot Crapper....What a loss Vlad.
Vladsblood
Regular
Seconded from me too! Vlad.
Similar threads
