AVZ Discussion 2022

Scoota30

Regular
I wouldn't buy a Chinese EV as yet.
I'm just considering looking for a BYD dealer in Oodnadatta could be a bit of a pain.
The Chinese are in the throws of flooding the world markets with cheap existing technology EV's.

It appears to me that people in Australia and now also in the US are not really taking up EV's and are more starting to look at PHEV's for obvious reasons. But buying a car with 2 propulsion systems, married together, makes it pretty clear that there is a problem with the current EV technology.

The other concern I have is with the current battery fires of electric scooters and E-bikes.
Is it that people use cheap and nasty chargers, or is it that the batteries are getting damaged due to insufficient quality suspension.
And how about jumping sand dunes with high powered 4x4 EV's?

I rather wait and watch developments like this.


Take anything that Toyota says with a grain of salt, they've been talking up their Li Ion/LFP battery killer for years as well as their hydrogen engines but all they seem to do is talk, and can't follow it up with walk. They've also been stung a few times recently for fraudulent safety testing and come out after the fact to say "I'm sorry".

Think you'll find that a lot of the media talking about EV sales slowing just isn't true and is a load of BS. It continues growing and taking market share off of the ICE vehicles, all while renewables continue taking a higher percentage off of fossil fuel based energy production and grid battery storage continues moving at a fair pace. The technology is proven - it works and is the solution.

Problem is though that China has a 20+ year gameplay at any given time and the west is too busy thinking 2-4 years at a time to do anything while bickering with themselves. Not to mention the leader of the free world sleepy Joe can't even string a full sentence together these days all while his press secretary tells everyone that those videos of him losing his marbles are "cheap fakes". If anything, China continues to extend their lead in the critical minerals race each year while the west is still trying to figure out a game plan to undo it all.

Hurry up RIO buy us out.
 
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Frank

Top 20
*Meanwhile,

In other News, back at the Energy Farm on the other side of the African / DRC fence where the grass is greener thanks to plenty of US Fertiliser,

I see the,

US backs Angola plan to process critical minerals, export power

US backs Angola.png


The US is backing Angola’s efforts to diversify from being an oil-dependent economy to becoming a critical-minerals processor and exporter of clean power, according to a top official.
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“Angola and the United States are aligned on all the major points related to energy access, energy security, decarbonization, and critical minerals,” US Assistant Secretary of State for Energy Resources Geoffrey Pyatt said at an online media briefing Tuesday.

The southern African nation, one of the top crude producers on the continent, has become a focus for the US in its campaign to secure critical minerals such as copper as it competes against China.


The US Export-Import Bank has earmarked billions of dollars in clean-energy projects to bolster capacity in the country that plans to sell excess electricity across the region.

Pyatt last week visited the capital, Luanda, and met with the nation’s oil and energy ministers.

The officials discussed the construction of transmission and grid interconnection infrastructure needed for Angola to become “a larger energy exporter to the rest of sub-Saharan Africa,” he said, according to a transcript of the remarks.

Ex-Im closed a $900 million loan for solar farms in Angola built by US developer Sun Africa, “which is committed to using non-Chinese components,” according to Pyatt.

The bank’s board referred to Congress for notification a $1.6 billion project with the same developer to construct mini-grids and clean water projects across the country.

Angola is also interested in developing downstream processing infrastructure for critical minerals, he said, adding that the US-backed Minerals Security Partnership Forum brings producers and customers to find potential financing opportunities from the US, European Union and others, to realize such projects.

mining.com

AVZ Minerals.png
 
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Frank

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CashKing

Regular
As much as I agree, I think having Chinese EV on the Aus market keeps the price down for other brands.
There are fields of unsold EVs parked and fading in the Chinese sun.
I’d disagree mate all the buses and mining vehicles etc are all going electric.

It doesn’t come down to just the Chinese shitty cars on our roads.
 
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TheCount

Regular
Spot on
I’d disagree mate all the buses and mining vehicles etc are all going electric.

It doesn’t come down to just the Chinese shitty cars on our roads.
Spot on - it's always been about "mass transport", not consumerland.
TC.
 
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Frank

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As much as I agree, I think having Chinese EV on the Aus market keeps the price down for other brands.
There are fields of unsold EVs parked and fading in the Chinese sun.

China wants to flood the world with its electric cars

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After conquering the national market, Chinese manufacturers intend to increase exports.

“New era, new car”: the eighteenth edition of the China International Automobile Exhibition opened on April 25 in Beijing and Chinese companies that produce electric cars are keen to show their models there.

The China Association of Automobile Manufacturers (CAAM) indicates that, of the approximately 336 million vehicles on China's roads, more than 6% – or around 20 million – are electric cars, buses and trucks.

The Chinese market also represented, in December 2023, 69% of global sales of this type of vehicle.

Chinese industry is showing its technical capabilities in the field of electric cars, where it has taken undeniable leadership in just a few years. Its objective now is to develop sales of these vehicles in as many countries as possible around the world.

A transformed automotive landscape

Around fifty years ago, half of the avenues of large Chinese cities were reserved for crowds of cyclists.

The horns of the few cars could be heard on the remaining part of the road.

Then, in the early 1990s, car traffic grew and quickly occupied almost all of the streets.

Many Chinese automobile companies then developed, the most important being Dongfeng, FAW (First Automobile Works), Chang'an Automobile, and SAIC (Shanghai Automotive Industry Corporation).

The vehicles produced were poorly efficient and the export structures to sell them outside China did not exist.

Chinese leaders therefore considered that cars manufactured in China were not able to compete with Western, Japanese or Korean brands, which sold their gasoline vehicles to the four corners of the planet.

During political meetings in Beijing, the parking lots of the National People's Congress were filled with Mercedes, BMWs and Audis, waiting for the representatives of the Chinese people.

Over the past three or four years, the Chinese automotive landscape has changed greatly.

To produce electric cars, Chinese manufacturers have a major advantage: for forty years, their country has managed to dominate most of the sector of rare earths and metals which are used to operate electric batteries.

Everything from the ore refining to the engine manufacturing plant is available in China.

The cars produced are almost all equipped with lithium-iron-phosphate batteries, a technology that does not cost very much and does not require cobalt. But they are heavy and difficult to recycle.

Result: there are nearly 130 electric car manufacturers in China.

There were around 500 in 2019, but many produced models of average quality, and others were eliminated by the fierce price war plaguing this rapidly evolving sector.

Today, around twenty groups have succeeded, through the quality of design of their cars and the low prices at which they sell them in China, in overcoming this competition.

In the eight huge halls of the Chinese Motor Show, where 1,500 exhibitors are held and where 800,000 visitors are expected until May 4, Chinese brands manufacturing electric cars are highlighted and take the spotlight.

The shifts of Chinese companies

Originally, most Chinese electric car manufacturers were engaged in another business.

Xiaomi, for example, which mainly manufactures smartphones, launched the production of the Speed Ultra 7 on March 28.

The price of this electric car will be around 28,000 euros, while its bodywork closely resembles that of the Taycan, electric version of the Porsche Panamera, which costs around 90,000 euros.

Xiaomi CEO Lei Jun announced that the Speed Ultra 7 had a range of 800 kilometers and that its acceleration was higher than that of models from the American company Tesla, which is headed by billionaire Elon Musk.

He is currently visiting China to meet Chinese international trade officials in order, national media explain, to “discuss next steps in terms of cooperation and other matters”.

Currently, the leader in electric cars in China is called BYD: its sales represent more than a third of the Chinese market.

The Chinese name of the company, Bǐyàdí Qìchē, was, for export purposes, transformed into BYD, the initials of “build your dreams”.

It was originally a simple battery factory, founded in 1995 in Shenzhen, a large city near Hong Kong that has become the headquarters of numerous technology groups.

BYD has developed a whole range ranging from cars to trucks and taxis to buses.

The K9 electric bus, in particular, has been purchased by many cities around the world.

The company's plan is now to expand in Europe, attempting to sell 300,000 electric cars there this year.

BYD models are the majority in the large quantities of Chinese electric cars that cargo ships have been bringing into the port of Antwerp for several months and which are waiting to be sold.

Several other Chinese electric car companies are also targeting exports.

In 2023, MG, which was originally born from the acquisition of a once-renowned English brand, has sold more than 20,000 copies of its MG4 in France alone.

Furthermore, Geely, which acquired ownership from Volvo in 2010, offers an electric crossover, the Zeekr 001, which is a high-end, 5-meter-long elevated station wagon.

Most of the gains that will provide all these Chinese companies from vehicle sales abroad currently seem to be intended to be reinvested in China, particularly in research and technological improvements.

Government helping hands

In Beijing, the government is closely monitoring the development of electric cars in China and regularly provides assistance to the sector.

For around ten years, buyers have benefited from tax exemptions and, since June 2023, tax reductions.

Purchase coupons are also distributed to those who decide to purchase an electric car.

On the other hand, the Chinese state grants, even if the amount has decreased, all kinds of financial aid to manufacturers.

The fact that many of the small builders who went bankrupt had previously pocketed public money seems to be seen as a secondary disadvantage.

The important thing, seen from Beijing, is to solidify the economic position of Chinese manufacturers.

Also, in Chinese provinces where electric cars are produced, central government aid is supplemented by local governments.

The purpose of all this financing is in particular to help Chinese manufacturers of electric cars to be in a strong position for export.

The commercial offensive launched by China regarding electric automobiles seems to have taken Western brands by surprise.

For more than forty years, their approach was to settle in China to produce and sell their cars there.

The procedure consisted of creating a joint venture, in which a Chinese company had the majority.

This is how Honda partnered with Dongfeng, like Nissan or Peugeot-Citroën, Ford with Chang'an, or even, from 1984, Volkswagen with SAIC.

However, since 2017, the Chinese government has changed the regulations: in the automotive sector, foreign companies no longer need to partner with a Chinese firm and can therefore have full ownership of their factories.

Immediately, the American company Tesla opened a company in Shanghai.

How to slow down the movement?

But today, the movement of sales goes from China to the West and European manufacturers hardly have battery supply chains.

A large number of them would have to be built quickly so that Europe can have real autonomy while, for the moment, the technologies and the price of batteries produced in China are very efficient.

According to Transport and Environment, 25% of electric cars circulating in Europe are already Chinese brands.

This international association, which campaigns for carbon-free transport, believes that a sharp increase in customs duties on these vehicles from China would favor European production.

Significantly increasing taxes on electric cars would, however, be part of a logic of economic protectionism which is not in line with the logic of the European Union and which, moreover, would probably lead to Chinese commercial retaliation.

At the end of 2023, the European Commission announced that it suspected Chinese automobile brands of unfair competition.

The Chinese government is reportedly providing significant subsidies to the electric vehicle sector.

In Beijing, the Ministry of Commerce responded by declaring that this investigation was likely to “violate the rules of the World Trade Organization (WTO) and the laws of the European Union”.

The European Commission's investigation continues.

The United States is much more determined than Europe to counter Chinese commercial expansionism, and therefore to block the sale of Chinese automobiles on their territory.

They have imposed considerable tariffs on Chinese vehicles.

This explains why Chinese manufacturers are now devoting their sales efforts to European markets.

BYD exports no fewer than eight models to Europe, while waiting to build a factory in Hungary.

The American Tesla, for its part, reacted by lowering the prices of its electric cars in Europe.


China can all the more seek to export its electric cars as its economy is experiencing a slowdown.

The end of the vast confinement, enacted from 2020 to 2022 due to the Covid-19 epidemic, did not bring about the strong and lasting resumption of economic growth that was hoped for in Beijing.

Therefore, it is likely that Chinese manufacturers of electric cars will be strongly encouraged to do everything to sell as much as possible in Europe, by playing on prices.

With a delay, European car manufacturers will have to adapt to the onslaught of Chinese companies.

When it comes to electric vehicles, the competitive war between Europe and China has only just begun.

mediacongo.net


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Flight996

Regular
Just wondering if anyone here has emailed Brad Thompson or Andrew Tillett at the AFR following their article Chinese lithium pioneer calls for fair go in Australia (17 Jun 2024).

If not, I am considering sending them a short summary about China's role in fucking over AVZ, and the federal government's silence on the issue.

Cheers
F
 
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CHB

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Flight996

Regular
How many stop work orders now? 2nd one? Wonder how many more will be issued where zijin DGAF

Yes, Zijin Mining and its subsidiary Jin Cheng Mining are protected species.

They are protected at every level of government, all the way to King Felix himself, proving once again that size matters.
 
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BigA

Member
IMG_2173.jpeg
 
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Doc

Master of Quan
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Panther22

Regular
Suspending is one thing, enforcing the suspension is another but we are sounding a little more hopeful.
 
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Scoota30

Regular
Spot on

Spot on - it's always been about "mass transport", not consumerland.
TC.
I would argue it is both TC - buses, roadtrains and actual trains will be a large part of it but so will autonomous EV's.

Tony Seba argues that it will be cheaper per km to pay for a autonomous EV's (AEV's) like a "robotaxi" as a service (Think Uber at the moment but no driver), than it will be to use/run an existing car that is already paid off. (TaaS - Transport as a Service).

Australia will be one of the last western countries for mass adoption IMO due to the large land mass and small population, but America and the EU will kick off with this due to high density areas (China is also rumoured to approve Tesla FSD this year)

There's even talk about robotaxis taking some market share off of short domestic flights. Think how long it takes from door to door (getting to airport, checking in, flying, grabbing baggage and driving to hotel) and compare that with being picked up at your door and taking an autonomous electric vehicle on a 6 hour drive where you can sit back in the privacy of the car.

Think about people who would prefer to take an AEV than catch the bus or train - if it costs the same why wouldn't they.

And for people doubting autonomous EV's, Waymo already has a driverless rideshare system running in San Francisco today, yes it isn't perfect but it's progressing, although they are Geofence restricted with HD mapping and have lots of LiDar sensors. Teslas vision only system (And Chinese Companies are already trying to copy it) has been improving rapidly since their FSD 12 Version and it will only become a matter of time before they "turn on" the system to their entire fleet as their hardware in all of the existing fleet is capable to handle the software.

I'm saying all of this because I'm not sure if the majority of people (Including Government) actually realise how strategically important Manono still is. By 2030 it will be glaringly obvious.

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The Great Transformation [Part 2] - The #Disruption of #Transportation

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Frank

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Frank

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TheCount

Regular
I would argue it is both TC - buses, roadtrains and actual trains will be a large part of it but so will autonomous EV's.

Tony Seba argues that it will be cheaper per km to pay for a autonomous EV's (AEV's) like a "robotaxi" as a service (Think Uber at the moment but no driver), than it will be to use/run an existing car that is already paid off. (TaaS - Transport as a Service).

Australia will be one of the last western countries for mass adoption IMO due to the large land mass and small population, but America and the EU will kick off with this due to high density areas (China is also rumoured to approve Tesla FSD this year)

There's even talk about robotaxis taking some market share off of short domestic flights. Think how long it takes from door to door (getting to airport, checking in, flying, grabbing baggage and driving to hotel) and compare that with being picked up at your door and taking an autonomous electric vehicle on a 6 hour drive where you can sit back in the privacy of the car.

Think about people who would prefer to take an AEV than catch the bus or train - if it costs the same why wouldn't they.

And for people doubting autonomous EV's, Waymo already has a driverless rideshare system running in San Francisco today, yes it isn't perfect but it's progressing, although they are Geofence restricted with HD mapping and have lots of LiDar sensors. Teslas vision only system (And Chinese Companies are already trying to copy it) has been improving rapidly since their FSD 12 Version and it will only become a matter of time before they "turn on" the system to their entire fleet as their hardware in all of the existing fleet is capable to handle the software.

I'm saying all of this because I'm not sure if the majority of people (Including Government) actually realise how strategically important Manono still is. By 2030 it will be glaringly obvious.

View attachment 65186

The Great Transformation [Part 2] - The #Disruption of #Transportation

View attachment 65187

tumblr_464feb526119bd854d98cc37990c664d_7efb97a3_540.gif
 
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Need help in registerying my AVZ assets, contacted Automic and they say I don't have anny assets at all, but my Interactive Brokers account is where I purchased my shares. Is this going to be an issue in getting my new SRN?
 
Need help in registerying my AVZ assets, contacted Automic and they say I don't have anny assets at all, but my Interactive Brokers account is where I purchased my shares. Is this going to be an issue in getting my new SRN?
Still tryna work through this with them
 

Spikerama

Regular
Still tryna work through this with them
Oh dear mate. Sorry to hear. Well at least you picked a good name.
 
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