AVZ Discussion 2022

[cruiser51]

Thanks cruiser. Simple answers are the best
So that's how it had to happen just to get the deal done. Aligning our interests with CATH just a nice side bonus it seems.

A few years ago, Woodside bought into the SNE field, now the Sangomar field from Conoco Phillips.

FAR had FROR and took Woodside to court over the deal and claimed they had FROR.

Woodside actually bought a subsidiary of Conoco Phillips, which held the rights to the tenements, and did not buy the tenements.
Because Conoco Phillips had their affairs organised this way, they bypassed the FROR rule and FAR lost the legal case.

Something similar applies here.
Cominiere holds their 25% in their name and the FROR applies as per contractual obligations.
AVZI holds its rights in Dathcom via the Subsidiary GLH, so in AVZI case the FROR for Cominiere does not apply, as AVZI sells a part of its subsidiary.

If that makes sense.

All IMO of course.

Don't forget Zijin also keeps distance by claiming their 'rights' to the northern section is being held by a subsidiary and thereby can say 'It wasn't us!'.

 

[BEISHA]

Hopefully this link will show where CATH’s influence and being our partner can affect the outcome of our ICSID and ICC cases

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static1.squarespace.com

certainly hope so, my eyes still water reading all that arbitration shit.......what a mess !

 

[cruiser51]

Does anyone have information on the relationship split in CATH (CATL + Pei)?
It would be useful to understand who is the senior partner, CATL or Pei, and therefore who really calls the shots within the entity.

I believe CATH is 50/50 owned by CATL and Mr. Pei.

 

[Goldenboy]

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He is having lunch with Superhooter. With any luck its special Beef Wellington.

 

[cruiser51]

certainly hope so, my eyes still water reading all that arbitration shit.......what a mess !

Try gin, it relaxes the bloodvessels.
Ask the count, he is an expert.

 

[PhatCatz]

I think something that is overlooked a tad in the forthcoming deal is that this is all of this underpinned by granting of the mining license for tenement 13359. I am silly to assume it's for the whole of 13359 as per the legal cases AVZ are currently fronting?

I still think the breakdown of holdings and who will have the controlling interest needs to be communicated by the company if this goes ahead. Some ambiguous language used and multiple responses on breakdown has been posted here. I've had another look and I still don't know clearly.

Also I'm not too well across voting rights of DRC etc but for arguments sake lets say this deal goes ahead and AVZ get screwed over at court or cease legal battles. If DRC having voting rights + existing Chinese interests on the books + CATH deal + what ever the fuck Zijin get out of this (Fuck em they deserve nothing) - is that enough to sway the voting balance of power to the Chinese? I'm actually unsure what INDIRECT interest is. even after a Googs and chatgpt quiz.

This is where my concern has been the last few days. This is kinda what happened at LLL and the games played by the Chinese to aggressively takeover/essentially lowball the project.

 

[BEISHA]

A few years ago, Woodside bought into the SNE field, now the Sangomar field from Conoco Phillips.

FAR had FROR and took Woodside to court over the deal and claimed they had FROR.

Woodside actually bought a subsidiary of Conoco Phillips, which held the rights to the tenements, and did not buy the tenements.
Because Conoco Phillips had their affairs organised this way, they bypassed the FROR rule and FAR lost the legal case.

Something similar applies here.
Cominiere holds their 25% in their name and the FROR applies as per contractual obligations.
AVZI holds its rights in Dathcom via the Subsidiary GLH, so in AVZI case the FROR for Cominiere does not apply, as AVZI sells a part of its subsidiary.

If that makes sense.

All IMO of course.

Don't forget Zijin also keeps distance by claiming their 'rights' to the northern section is being held by a subsidiary and thereby can say 'It wasn't us!'.

As i was a FAR investor back in the day, i can categorically say your assessment of WPL & Cocono Phillips is correct and poor ole far who did all the hard yakka of successfully finding oil 12 out 12 drills got completely shafted.

The difference between the senegal oil find and manono regards to FIRB , is WPL is a australian coy first and foremost and the oil find whilst lucrative, is not a smidge of the geopolitical significance as roche dure / CDL .

imo

 

[BEISHA]

I think something that is overlooked a tad in the forthcoming deal is that this is all of this underpinned by granting of the mining license for tenement 13359. I am silly to assume it's for the whole of 13359 as per the legal cases AVZ are currently fronting?

I still think the breakdown of holdings and who will have the controlling interest needs to be communicated by the company if this goes ahead. Some ambiguous language used and multiple responses on breakdown has been posted here. I've had another look and I still don't know clearly.

Also I'm not too well across voting rights of DRC etc but for arguments sake lets say this deal goes ahead and AVZ get screwed over at court or cease legal battles. If DRC having voting rights + existing Chinese interests on the books + CATH deal + what ever the fuck Zijin get out of this (Fuck em they deserve nothing) - is that enough to sway the voting balance of power to the Chinese? I'm actually unsure what INDIRECT interest is. even after a Googs and chatgpt quiz.

This is where my concern has been the last few days. This is kinda what happened at LLL and the games played by the Chinese to aggressively takeover/essentially lowball the project.

Correct me if i wrong tho, LLL investors got a payout ?

 

[Frank]

x.com

x.com

 

[cruiser51]

As i was a FAR investor back in the day, i can categorically say your assessment of WPL & Cocono Phillips is correct and poor ole far who did all the hard yakka of successfully finding oil 12 out 12 drills got completely shafted.

The difference between the senegal oil find and manono regards to FIRB , is WPL is a australian coy first and foremost and the oil find whilst lucrative, is not a smidge of the geopolitical significance as roche dure / CDL .

imo

I have to agree with you that FAR got shafted.

Senegal’s Sangomar oil field exceeds 2024 output target​

Senegal's Sangomar oil field surpasses its 2024 target with 16.9 million barrels (average oil price over last 12 months AUD $120), boosted by new FPSO and record exports

I think it was an expensive over sight.
I don't know why FAR did not understand the significance of CP holding the SNE tenement in a BV (PTY) holding company, registered in the Netherlands.

I was trading in FAR, got out when I saw the game being played and hold WDS longterm.

 

[BEISHA]

I have to agree with you that FAR got shafted.

Senegal’s Sangomar oil field exceeds 2024 output target​

Senegal's Sangomar oil field surpasses its 2024 target with 16.9 million barrels (average oil price over last 12 months AUD $120), boosted by new FPSO and record exports

I think it was an expensive over sight.
I don't know why FAR did not understand the significance of CP holding the SNE tenement in a BV (PTY) holding company, registered in the Netherlands.

I was trading in FAR, got out when I saw the game being played and hold WDS longterm.

Yeah i traded FAR, made coin and also got out when the shit fight occurred, but most held thinking the legals was on their side........until it wasnt

 

[Frank]

x.com

x.com

 

[BEISHA]

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x.com

x.com

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All this with 30yrs of chinese investment too.....

And yet despite all that.........DRC is one of the poorest countries in the world, relying on World bank and IMF to prop their ailing balance sheet.

Shameful !

 

[Carlos Danger]

I think something that is overlooked a tad in the forthcoming deal is that this is all of this underpinned by granting of the mining license for tenement 13359. I am silly to assume it's for the whole of 13359 as per the legal cases AVZ are currently fronting?

I still think the breakdown of holdings and who will have the controlling interest needs to be communicated by the company if this goes ahead. Some ambiguous language used and multiple responses on breakdown has been posted here. I've had another look and I still don't know clearly.

Also I'm not too well across voting rights of DRC etc but for arguments sake lets say this deal goes ahead and AVZ get screwed over at court or cease legal battles. If DRC having voting rights + existing Chinese interests on the books + CATH deal + what ever the fuck Zijin get out of this (Fuck em they deserve nothing) - is that enough to sway the voting balance of power to the Chinese? I'm actually unsure what INDIRECT interest is. even after a Googs and chatgpt quiz.

This is where my concern has been the last few days. This is kinda what happened at LLL and the games played by the Chinese to aggressively takeover/essentially lowball the project.

This wouldn't be happening without ML being somewhat progressed with the understanding DRC deal with Pei moving forward and processing is done in country imo

GLH's holding in Dathcom will always vote as one block so AVZ will maintain legal control of GLH at 59.4% and therefore control of the Manono project offcially

However I doubt Pei is fronting the cash, building the plants and sorting out the ML without having a large degree of say on how things will be run

But again we will have the fail safe of legal control of GLH to prevent any shenanigans imo

The terms of the new TIA do mean we get 44.5% of the profit rather than 51% of the profit under the old TIA whichever way you look at it

 

[Pokok]

Good to see you here Whiddon, you are completely wasted on that shit hole crapper site thats for sure , hoping to see more of you here and less over there in future....

Mate, you clearly are alot more clued up in the company structures than i am, after all, i am just a simple tradie ( hell, i didnt even know GLH was a entity so fark me )

That being said, this whole restructured deal with Cath comes with alot of conjecture including the arbitration cases yet to be resolved and ultimately, only the AVZ BOD really knows the correct equation going forward

I will attempt to contact the BOSS and seek clarification on this percentage structure, although i would think that is sensitive information so even if he told me, i wouldnt be able to reveal in any case.

Hopefully we get a formal announcement in the not too distant future explaining the mix cause i highly doubt we will need to wait until the next AGM for question time as i get the strong vibe a resolution to this mess is not that far away.

imo

Me also just a simple painter ready to retire

 

[Winenut]

Me also just a simple painter ready to retire

Impressionist? Surrealist? Water Colour? Realist? Expressionist? Landscape? Portrait? Dulux????

Just stirring

 

[DiscoDanNZ]

I think something that is overlooked a tad in the forthcoming deal is that this is all of this underpinned by granting of the mining license for tenement 13359. I am silly to assume it's for the whole of 13359 as per the legal cases AVZ are currently fronting?

I still think the breakdown of holdings and who will have the controlling interest needs to be communicated by the company if this goes ahead. Some ambiguous language used and multiple responses on breakdown has been posted here. I've had another look and I still don't know clearly.

Also I'm not too well across voting rights of DRC etc but for arguments sake lets say this deal goes ahead and AVZ get screwed over at court or cease legal battles. If DRC having voting rights + existing Chinese interests on the books + CATH deal + what ever the fuck Zijin get out of this (Fuck em they deserve nothing) - is that enough to sway the voting balance of power to the Chinese? I'm actually unsure what INDIRECT interest is. even after a Googs and chatgpt quiz.

This is where my concern has been the last few days. This is kinda what happened at LLL and the games played by the Chinese to aggressively takeover/essentially lowball the project.

ML being granted has always been a condition for CATH/Daddy since the original deal was first signed.

Daddy obviously thinks we're in with a chance or he wouldn't waste his time thinking about this new deal IMO

 

[Scoota30]

This wouldn't be happening without ML being somewhat progressed with the understanding DRC deal with Pei moving forward and processing is done in country imo

GLH's holding in Dathcom will always vote as one block so AVZ will maintain legal control of GLH at 59.4% and therefore control of the Manono project offcially

However I doubt Pei is fronting the cash, building the plants and sorting out the ML without having a large degree of say on how things will be run

But again we will have the fail safe of legal control of GLH to prevent any shenanigans imo

The terms of the new TIA do mean we get 44.5% of the profit rather than 51% of the profit under the old TIA whichever way you look at it

And the tradeoff for this is the 49% ownership for us in the lithium hydroxide facility IMO. as you said, legally we still maintain majority control with regards to voting rights/control, but if Pei's total indirect ownership takes him over 50% that gives even more incentive to get this thing on the show.

It's a good way to move forward, split a bit of the pie and save face for most actors. Wonder if CATH approached us after Locke Funding or if we tried approaching them.
Either way, time for some bubbly....?

 

[TheCount]

Where would the rights to the tin sit?
Thx.

 

[whales]

Some

32 w 2

This wouldn't be happening without ML being somewhat progressed with the understanding DRC deal with Pei moving forward and processing is done in country imo

GLH's holding in Dathcom will always vote as one block so AVZ will maintain legal control of GLH at 59.4% and therefore control of the Manono project offcially

However I doubt Pei is fronting the cash, building the plants and sorting out the ML without having a large degree of say on how things will be run

But again we will have the fail safe of legal control of GLH to prevent any shenanigans imo

The terms of the new TIA do mean we get 44.5% of the profit rather than 51% of the profit under the old TIA whichever way you look at it

Pei also gets 100% offtake.
and will be at an excellent rate.
CATL secures it's lithium supply for the next 50 plus years .
Add a lithium hydroxide plant and CATL will be selling to Ganfeng and other majors .
Definitely a win win all round.
The only uncertainty is will the mining licence be for all of 13359 .
And Zijin are out completely .