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- Thread starter cosors
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beserk
Regular
Hello all
I have been away from the ins and outs of the stretched out process with the final permit for mining of the Nunasvaari graphite. And yes, beside the Sami reindeer owners in Talma and Gabna reindeer co-ops that will keep on going, come hell or high water, it is the phalanx within the Social Democratic Kiruna council that are the last hold outs.
And they are locally connected in the village of Vittangi but as someone among us picked up there are villagers that are pro mining and are desperately looking for Jobs for the young people of Vittangi.
The village is in a death spiral with 700 inhabitants. Half of the villagers are past 65 years of age and the 250 strong productive working age population is mostly composed of people that commute for work elsewhere or hav found lowly paid jobs in the service industry. Besides the hard core of over wintering greens that don't want to get their hands dirty.
I'm travelling to my hunting and fishing grounds up north this May. I will try to meet in person with Mats Taaveniku, who lives in Kiruna and is the voice of reason within the local Social Democratic Party, but also with my relatives that are still living in Vittangi village.
Hopefully we will have left this mess behind us and the mining works have restarted in Njunisvarri Onwards and forwards!
No worries
I have been away from the ins and outs of the stretched out process with the final permit for mining of the Nunasvaari graphite. And yes, beside the Sami reindeer owners in Talma and Gabna reindeer co-ops that will keep on going, come hell or high water, it is the phalanx within the Social Democratic Kiruna council that are the last hold outs.
And they are locally connected in the village of Vittangi but as someone among us picked up there are villagers that are pro mining and are desperately looking for Jobs for the young people of Vittangi.
The village is in a death spiral with 700 inhabitants. Half of the villagers are past 65 years of age and the 250 strong productive working age population is mostly composed of people that commute for work elsewhere or hav found lowly paid jobs in the service industry. Besides the hard core of over wintering greens that don't want to get their hands dirty.
I'm travelling to my hunting and fishing grounds up north this May. I will try to meet in person with Mats Taaveniku, who lives in Kiruna and is the voice of reason within the local Social Democratic Party, but also with my relatives that are still living in Vittangi village.
Hopefully we will have left this mess behind us and the mining works have restarted in Njunisvarri Onwards and forwards!
No worries
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cosors
👀
Hi and welcome 'back'!
Maybe you could listen to this short snippet for us if there is any info interesting for us at the end?
S-nej till grafitgruva utanför Vittangi - Sameradion
Socialdemokraterna i Kiruna säger efter en medlemsomröstning nej till en grafitgruva i Njunisvárri mellan Vittangi och Svappavaara, rapporterar NSD.Företaget ...
The Social Democrats in Kiruna say no to a graphite mine in Njunisvárri. Municipal councilor Mats Taaveniku is uncertain about the consequences.
And have fun and success in May and, of course, good hunting!
beserk
Regular
Hi Cosors
I have listened to the news snippet from the newsprogram produced for the Sami population by the Swedish broadcaster, Sveriges Radio.
Essentially there exists a slim majority within the Social Democratic party in Kiruna, against opening up the Graphite mine in Nunasvaara (Finnish spelling) or Njunisvaari (Northern Sami spelling). And as I have already mentioned Social Democrats (S), the Left party (the old Communists) , Feminist Initiative (FI) and the Sami parti (SL) form the governing body within Kiruna municipality council led by Councillor Taaveniku. While the pro-mining opposition is compromised of the Moderate party (M), the Christ Democrats (KD), the Center party (C), the Sweden Democrats (SD) and one special interest party.
The final vote within Soc Dems (S) is now going to be followed by a vote of the whole municipal council. And the matter to be decided is the question of allowing the final planning permit for the Talga mine works. Kiruna council has the last say on issuing planning permits within its borders. I predict the vote might be close since Cr Taaveniku and a sizeable minority of Soc Dems (S) are for job creation and thus pro- mining. Together with M, C, KD and SD they might balance out the anti-mining faction of the S party, plus the rump of elected local gov reps for the Left party, FI and SL.
However, the Swedish Government can over rule any objection raised by the Council if it believes national interest over rides local Government objections.
There is presedens in Swedish law for this. Mining of chalk on the island of Gotland for production of necessary concrete and cement for the Swedish construction industry was disallowed by local Government but over ruled due to national interest by Swedish Government.
And the Swedish Government, through its Minister for Employment, and Leader of the Liberals, Johan Pehrson, has already signalled that the Government he is part of, will quickly raise the national interest argument if Kiruna council will not approve the required planning permit.
As an aside, it was Minister Pehrson on behalf of the Swedish Government, that attended the ceremonial start of the construction of Talgas battery anode factory at the Luleå Industrial Park in September last year.
So Minister Pehrson, and the Government he is representing, have got a vested interest to keep the graphite mine outside Vittangi and Talgas battery anode factory in Luleå on track.
No worries
Roger
I have listened to the news snippet from the newsprogram produced for the Sami population by the Swedish broadcaster, Sveriges Radio.
Essentially there exists a slim majority within the Social Democratic party in Kiruna, against opening up the Graphite mine in Nunasvaara (Finnish spelling) or Njunisvaari (Northern Sami spelling). And as I have already mentioned Social Democrats (S), the Left party (the old Communists) , Feminist Initiative (FI) and the Sami parti (SL) form the governing body within Kiruna municipality council led by Councillor Taaveniku. While the pro-mining opposition is compromised of the Moderate party (M), the Christ Democrats (KD), the Center party (C), the Sweden Democrats (SD) and one special interest party.
The final vote within Soc Dems (S) is now going to be followed by a vote of the whole municipal council. And the matter to be decided is the question of allowing the final planning permit for the Talga mine works. Kiruna council has the last say on issuing planning permits within its borders. I predict the vote might be close since Cr Taaveniku and a sizeable minority of Soc Dems (S) are for job creation and thus pro- mining. Together with M, C, KD and SD they might balance out the anti-mining faction of the S party, plus the rump of elected local gov reps for the Left party, FI and SL.
However, the Swedish Government can over rule any objection raised by the Council if it believes national interest over rides local Government objections.
There is presedens in Swedish law for this. Mining of chalk on the island of Gotland for production of necessary concrete and cement for the Swedish construction industry was disallowed by local Government but over ruled due to national interest by Swedish Government.
And the Swedish Government, through its Minister for Employment, and Leader of the Liberals, Johan Pehrson, has already signalled that the Government he is part of, will quickly raise the national interest argument if Kiruna council will not approve the required planning permit.
As an aside, it was Minister Pehrson on behalf of the Swedish Government, that attended the ceremonial start of the construction of Talgas battery anode factory at the Luleå Industrial Park in September last year.
So Minister Pehrson, and the Government he is representing, have got a vested interest to keep the graphite mine outside Vittangi and Talgas battery anode factory in Luleå on track.
No worries
Roger
[/URL]S-nej till grafitgruva utanför Vittangi - Sameradion
Socialdemokraterna i Kiruna säger efter en medlemsomröstning nej till en grafitgruva i Njunisvárri mellan Vittangi och Svappavaara, rapporterar NSD.Företaget ...sverigesradio.se
The Social Democrats in Kiruna say no to a graphite mine in Njunisvárri. Municipal councilor Mats Taaveniku is uncertain about the consequences.
And have fun and success in May and, of course, good hunting!
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curiousmagpie
Regular
If Swedish government intervention is going to be required what timescale are we looking at for a decision to be overturned? My faith in timely resolution of these matters is currently not strong
Additionally, what is the timeframe or likelihood that the national government could change parties and decide not to raise the mine as a national interest?
Especially seeing as they don't even need to over-rule the 'mining' part. Just the local NIMBY's abusing the planning regulations to try and stop a mine that was already approved by the proper (and long) due process. Those sort of shenannigans deserve to be overruled.
cosors
👀
Thank you very much for taking the time for us! I really appreciate it!
Monkeymandan
Regular
Courtesy of MPK1980 over at HC. Quite the line up.
Now please just stamp the f#cking permit SC judges!
Benchmark is delighted to announce the return of Giga Europe 2024 - where the region’s government, industry and finance will meet to chart a course for the region's lithium ion economy, from mine to electric vehicle.
We are excited to announce that Stockholm has been selected as host city: home to one of the most important hubs of green industry in Europe, Sweden offers the ideal space to unlock future potential in the lithium ion battery and EV industry.
Now please just stamp the f#cking permit SC judges!
Benchmark is delighted to announce the return of Giga Europe 2024 - where the region’s government, industry and finance will meet to chart a course for the region's lithium ion economy, from mine to electric vehicle.
We are excited to announce that Stockholm has been selected as host city: home to one of the most important hubs of green industry in Europe, Sweden offers the ideal space to unlock future potential in the lithium ion battery and EV industry.
beserk
Regular
SVT play has started a series of programs about Mines and Humans that is accessible on svt.se web site. There are 3 parts of 30 minutes each. All in Swedish though. For a Swedish audience.
Part 1 was broadcast a few days ago. In the first part different views of local people living close to the Kaunis Iron Ore open cut mine works outside Pajala were presented. The Kaunis Iron mine works lie 150 km south east of Vittangi and Nunasvaara. And the mine works produces roughly 100 90 tonnes truck loads of Iron ore every 24 hours.
So one fully loaded 90 tonnes truck every 20 minutes passes Vittangi village on the road to the rail road reloading station in Svappavaara. From there the Iron ore is loaded on train sets that depart for the export harbour in Narvik, Norway three times daily year around.
And of course the fully loaded trucks pass the turn off to Nunasvaara. One truck, every twenty minutes, year around, three km from the proposed Nunasvaara South graphite mine site.
As a comparison it would take 2 truck loads daily from Nunasvaara, to transport the graphite required for the battery anode production Luleå facility, to join the caravan of Iron ore trucks already plying the logistical transport chain along road 395.
It is somewhat disingenous from the Nature Protection Society and the Sami Coops to claim that the proposed Graphite mine works are going to disturb a pristine "wilderness" environment and the Sami reindeer husbandry with the existing mine transport logistical route around the corner.
Also the giant 200 meter deep, 1 km in circumference, open cut iron ore mine lies 100 km down stream along the same 'pristine' Torne river that flows past Nunasvaara South and Vittangi village.
I would venture a guess that the Kaunis Iron Ore works has a much larger local impact on the river. At least down stream for all concerned environmentalists in Finland. They raised the alarm when the Nunasvaara South mine works enviro impact statement was under review. Without mentioning the impact of the existing downstream Kaunis Iron Ore works.
In the first part of the SvT series, a balanced view of proponents and opponents to the already existing Kaunis Iron mine works are presented.
I found the local reindeer owner Mr Lantto, a fresh breath of air, as he put the minimal impact of the mine works on his herd of reindeer in context of the benefits of the mine to the community of Pajala.
In the series a Coucillor in Pajala was interviewed about the long term decline of the services due to the population decline from 15 000 to 6 000 in Pajala council. And he pointed to the clear link to creation of local Jobs in Pajala to stop the decline.
I would argue his arguments are equally valid for Vittangi village that is on its final population decline.
Part 1 was broadcast a few days ago. In the first part different views of local people living close to the Kaunis Iron Ore open cut mine works outside Pajala were presented. The Kaunis Iron mine works lie 150 km south east of Vittangi and Nunasvaara. And the mine works produces roughly 100 90 tonnes truck loads of Iron ore every 24 hours.
So one fully loaded 90 tonnes truck every 20 minutes passes Vittangi village on the road to the rail road reloading station in Svappavaara. From there the Iron ore is loaded on train sets that depart for the export harbour in Narvik, Norway three times daily year around.
And of course the fully loaded trucks pass the turn off to Nunasvaara. One truck, every twenty minutes, year around, three km from the proposed Nunasvaara South graphite mine site.
As a comparison it would take 2 truck loads daily from Nunasvaara, to transport the graphite required for the battery anode production Luleå facility, to join the caravan of Iron ore trucks already plying the logistical transport chain along road 395.
It is somewhat disingenous from the Nature Protection Society and the Sami Coops to claim that the proposed Graphite mine works are going to disturb a pristine "wilderness" environment and the Sami reindeer husbandry with the existing mine transport logistical route around the corner.
Also the giant 200 meter deep, 1 km in circumference, open cut iron ore mine lies 100 km down stream along the same 'pristine' Torne river that flows past Nunasvaara South and Vittangi village.
I would venture a guess that the Kaunis Iron Ore works has a much larger local impact on the river. At least down stream for all concerned environmentalists in Finland. They raised the alarm when the Nunasvaara South mine works enviro impact statement was under review. Without mentioning the impact of the existing downstream Kaunis Iron Ore works.
In the first part of the SvT series, a balanced view of proponents and opponents to the already existing Kaunis Iron mine works are presented.
I found the local reindeer owner Mr Lantto, a fresh breath of air, as he put the minimal impact of the mine works on his herd of reindeer in context of the benefits of the mine to the community of Pajala.
In the series a Coucillor in Pajala was interviewed about the long term decline of the services due to the population decline from 15 000 to 6 000 in Pajala council. And he pointed to the clear link to creation of local Jobs in Pajala to stop the decline.
I would argue his arguments are equally valid for Vittangi village that is on its final population decline.
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beserk
Regular
The conflict between 30 Norwegian Sami reindeer herders in the Fosen area of south western Norway and the Norwegian Government, that granted permission for a park of giant wind mills, on reindeer grazing land, generating green clean sustainable energy has reached its conclusion. All according to this news report in SVT Sapmi.
www.svt.se
As you recall there was a band of young Sami and Green activists that occupied the central parts of Oslo for a few weeks last year. They were joined by Greta who spoke about 'Green colonialism' as a way to describe what had happened to the 1000 reindeer and the Fosen Sami families as a result of the construction of the wind mills.
I correctly predicted that a solution would be found involving the Norwegian Government paying the 30 families, in addition to the Government subsidies that already are supporting their livelihoods, some extra money, or 7 million NOK to be exact, in compensation. The settlement is thus 7000 NOK or 600 Euro per reindeer ie 20 Euro per kg of reindeer steak, in addition to allowing the Fosen Sami access to some mountain meadows to compensate for the lost grazing area.
The Chairman of the Fosen Sami, Mr Haugen, was interviewed by SVT Sapmi and said the Norwegian Sami were OK with the outcome, as they should be, and would not take the fight further to the Supreme Court. Being paid as 'Government employed game keepers' of their reindeer twice seems to be enough of an incentive.
And the giant wind mills that already dot the fells around Fosen will stay. Much to the chagrin of the protesters and opponents of 'Green colonialism' like Greta I imagine. That like a latter day Don Quixote were fighting the giant ogres and lost.
I wish the Swedish Sami of Gabna and Talma villages would be as reasonable as their Norwegian brethren. But here across the border the Sami will not listen to reason or accept any compromise it seems.
They are caught in their mistaken believes that they are the 'ur people ' and that they are the overlords of the Northern lands only to willing to take all their grievances to the Highest Court instance of Sweden.
I think they might find themselves jousting against progress, if not wind mills, and that they will also find that 'Green colonialism' is an empty concept.
No worries
Norra Fosen-gruppen överens med regeringen
Efter flera omgångar av stora demonstrationer i Oslo. Nu ser striden om vindkraften på Fosen ut att vara löst där Norra Fosen-gruppen och regeringen har enats om ett avtal. – Vi hade gärna kämpat vidare för att vinna på nytt i Högsta domstolen, säger Terje Haugen, ledare av Nordfosen...
www.svt.se
As you recall there was a band of young Sami and Green activists that occupied the central parts of Oslo for a few weeks last year. They were joined by Greta who spoke about 'Green colonialism' as a way to describe what had happened to the 1000 reindeer and the Fosen Sami families as a result of the construction of the wind mills.
I correctly predicted that a solution would be found involving the Norwegian Government paying the 30 families, in addition to the Government subsidies that already are supporting their livelihoods, some extra money, or 7 million NOK to be exact, in compensation. The settlement is thus 7000 NOK or 600 Euro per reindeer ie 20 Euro per kg of reindeer steak, in addition to allowing the Fosen Sami access to some mountain meadows to compensate for the lost grazing area.
The Chairman of the Fosen Sami, Mr Haugen, was interviewed by SVT Sapmi and said the Norwegian Sami were OK with the outcome, as they should be, and would not take the fight further to the Supreme Court. Being paid as 'Government employed game keepers' of their reindeer twice seems to be enough of an incentive.
And the giant wind mills that already dot the fells around Fosen will stay. Much to the chagrin of the protesters and opponents of 'Green colonialism' like Greta I imagine. That like a latter day Don Quixote were fighting the giant ogres and lost.
I wish the Swedish Sami of Gabna and Talma villages would be as reasonable as their Norwegian brethren. But here across the border the Sami will not listen to reason or accept any compromise it seems.
They are caught in their mistaken believes that they are the 'ur people ' and that they are the overlords of the Northern lands only to willing to take all their grievances to the Highest Court instance of Sweden.
I think they might find themselves jousting against progress, if not wind mills, and that they will also find that 'Green colonialism' is an empty concept.
No worries
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cosors
👀
interesting!
Well, the Swedish reindeer lords are not entirely uninterested in sales and making money either.
But the issue here is which is more weighty, the indigenous community as a group worthy of protection or internal individual interests. To me, this reads as if some lords and businessmen are a little greedy and at the same time trying to cover themselves behind their community, which is supposed to pay the penalty even though they are responsible for it as only they are allowed to keep the reindeer and therefore only they decide what happens to them and not the community.
Some are illegally keeping too many reindeers, 1102 too many.) The Sami community as a whole should pay the bill for this, but they didn't and the lords didn't slaughtered or sold their reindeers either. In this case, the right of their lords are stronger than that of the community it seems. An internal Sami conflict that proves exactly what you have described to us.
For us from the outside, it looks sometimes completely different and more idyllic. A community that drives togehter its herds of reindeer across the pastures in harmony with nature to bear the fruits as a community. But it's not like that. This is sometimes used as an image and tool for the outside world and press I think. I only mention this because this article clearly summarises this.
The chairman of the Sami village believes that the demands for penalty should instead be directed at individual members of the Sami village who do not abide by the rules. But with Talga, this individual responsibility should suddenly no longer apply. With this logic, Talga would have reindeer herders as individual plaintiffs against and not an entire community that feels threatened by genocide. Sometimes this way and sometimes that, just as it suits.)
But read for yourself if you like.
Efter viteskravet: Ruvhten Sijte har fortfarande för många renar
Länsstyrelsen hotade med miljonvite om Ruvhten Sijte inte slaktar fler renar. Nu erkänner samebyn att man inte har levt upp till kraven. ”Vi är medvetna om att samebyn inte uppnått länsstyrelsens vitesföreläggande”, skriver ordföranden Marcus Rensberg.
www.svt.se
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The Limiting Factor channel on youtube just released a video to his Patreon supporters (I am a supporter and I recommend supporting him if you're interested in battery technology) analyzing the fact that the Tesla 4680 battery cell that he had analyzed was found to likely had 100% synthetic anode. He says in the video that it's not a threat to Talga though because there will be enough demand for anode that all of it will be sold regardless of whether it's natural or synthetic.
beserk
Regular
An interesting news snippet from SVT that discusses the flip side of a booming mining sector in Pajala council since the start up of the Kaunis Iron mine works and creation of the transport network by 90 tonnes trucks, one every 20 minutes 24/7, passing down the logistical transport chain comprised of road 395 past Vittangi and Nunasvaara.
The young people of Pajala are all gainfully employed in the local mining sector and more people from southern sweden has had to be enticed to move to Pajala by high wages and generous entitlements. This all is happening in the context of the steep population decline in Pajala council from 15 000 inhabitants of the 70ies to the present 6 000. Of which 50 % are receiving a State pension.
The mine works and logistical transport sector vacuums up the workforce and the service job sector is consequently severely short on people. As discussed in the SVT news item.
https://www.svt.se/nyheter/lokalt/n...VQ90LJB2i109SBNJ-7K4HfcBYLtA8iHb-ugMHmjAw3W3Q
And the programme series of The mine and The Human on SVT play that I mentioned in another posting touches on this conundrum.
The situation in Vittangi is possibly even more dire with the whole local employable workforce down to 2 or 3 dozen potential future Talga employees living in the area. And the people that have clawed out a living in Vittangi are employed in low paying service jobs.
Vittangi village has got its fare share of houses where nobody lives or typically you are met by an elderly couple or a widower or widow. They are generally welcoming when you introduce yourself and present your connections to the original Settler families in the village.
I will make a trip to my home village in tail spin to investigate the population decline on site and see how many actively employable persons still live in the village at end of May beginning of June.
And yes I worry about what I will find out
Beserk
The young people of Pajala are all gainfully employed in the local mining sector and more people from southern sweden has had to be enticed to move to Pajala by high wages and generous entitlements. This all is happening in the context of the steep population decline in Pajala council from 15 000 inhabitants of the 70ies to the present 6 000. Of which 50 % are receiving a State pension.
The mine works and logistical transport sector vacuums up the workforce and the service job sector is consequently severely short on people. As discussed in the SVT news item.
https://www.svt.se/nyheter/lokalt/n...VQ90LJB2i109SBNJ-7K4HfcBYLtA8iHb-ugMHmjAw3W3Q
And the programme series of The mine and The Human on SVT play that I mentioned in another posting touches on this conundrum.
The situation in Vittangi is possibly even more dire with the whole local employable workforce down to 2 or 3 dozen potential future Talga employees living in the area. And the people that have clawed out a living in Vittangi are employed in low paying service jobs.
Vittangi village has got its fare share of houses where nobody lives or typically you are met by an elderly couple or a widower or widow. They are generally welcoming when you introduce yourself and present your connections to the original Settler families in the village.
I will make a trip to my home village in tail spin to investigate the population decline on site and see how many actively employable persons still live in the village at end of May beginning of June.
And yes I worry about what I will find out
Beserk
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cosors
👀
A resident of Vittangi replied to the post by this stubborn politician N_ilsson from Kiruna in the Facebook anti mining group. I find it almost unbelievable that a politician from a town that exists because of mining is a poster in an anti-mining group.
Here are the words of the Vittangi citizen:
K_alle A_splund
Kenneth, I have asked and asked but have not received an answer, what do you mean by the sentence "Yes to a future without mining", what does the "future" consist of, Vittangi is almost dead, a small Coop store that sells mostly candy and milk, why are you not out in the village and argue or explain what the "future" consists of, I miss you and bring that councillor Taaveniko so he can explain your policy regarding Vittangi
Maybe you can exchange with Kalle over a coffee in the local Coop store.
___
and the answer of the politician:
Maybe you should get involved politically to pursue your line about more mines in our area. There are certainly some parties to the right of S that want to pursue your line.
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beserk
Regular
I just now saw that the Swedish Government will be represented at the GIGA Europe Event by our own Martin Philips and by Swedish Deputy Prime Minister and Minister for Business and Industry Ms Ebba Busch, leader of the Christian Democrats (KD).
She as you recall travelled back and forth to Kiruna at the beginning of 2023, when Sweden held the rotating Chairmanship of EU to announce exciting new finds of rare earth metals AND graphite within the strategically important mining district of Kiruna.
Wonder what time of the year this meeting is being held in Stockholm?
No worries
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Pharvest
Member
Love the Busch
JoMo68
Regular
Love the Busch
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