BRN Discussion Ongoing

[Deleted member 118]

 

[Stable Genius]

I had a quick look at Magna and they are linked with a lot of car manufactures. One would think a company of this size has taken a look at Brainchip and tested what it can do. I note Ford and TATA are amongst their customers. I do recall hearing/reading something about them previously but I’m still jogging my memory to remember where?


Global Customer Value

We have deep systems knowledge and supply 58 OEMs. Our products and systems are on two out of every three vehicles launched around the world through 2019 and Magna is the only automotive supplier in the world with expertise in the whole vehicle – from electronics to body to powertrain to complete vehicle manufacturing.

Click the selections below to view our list of customers around the world.

OEM
• Aston Martin
• BAIC Motor
• Beijing Automobile Works
• BMW
• Borgward
• Brilliance China
• BYD
• Canoo
• Changan Auto
• Chery
• CNH Industrial
• Cowin
• Daimler
• Dongfeng Honda
• Dongfeng Limited
• Dongfeng Motors
• Enovate
• FAW
• FAW Volkswagen
• Ferrari
• Fisker
• Force Motors
• Ford Motor
• Future Mobility
• GAC Honda
• GAC Motor
• GAC NIO
• GAZ
• Geely Group
• General Motors
• Great Wall Automobile
• Haima Zhengzhou
• Honda Motor
• Human Horizons
• Hyundai Motor
• INEOS
• Isuzu Motor
• Jianghuai
• Lixiang
• Lucid Motors
• Mahindra & Mahindra
• Mazda Motor
• McLaren Cars
• NIO
• Qoros
• Renault-Nissan-Mitsubishi
• Rivian Automotive
• SAIC Motor
• SAIC-GM-Wuling
• South-east Automobile
• Stellantis
• Subaru
• Suzuki Motor
• Tata
• Toyota Motor
• Vinfast
• Volkswagen
• WM Motor
• Xiaopeng

Cheers

 

[Stable Genius]

I’m trying to recall the name of the European AI advisory board to check if they were in that list which was pretty influential as they were trying to establish industry standards for adas cars but I can’t find them.

 

[Diogenese]

The probability of say three LiDAR sensors each receiving direct hits at exactly the same time where you have a majority decision making process also would need to be factored in to the associated risk of such an occurrence not that I could do the maths but as you add each sensor your initial odds of a direct hit are becoming factors less.

Something which I remembered from my dark and distant past when I had to learn all about the police radar in the event that I had to prosecute a defended case was that the reason the police radar operator was instructed to obtain a clear solid signal on the radar instrument for at least three seconds before a prosecution for a given exceed speed could be prosecuted was to overcome any possibility of interference of the type you are referring too.

I could try to explain it in greater detail but it is such a long time ago we are talking the 1970's when I did the training course it would get a bit messy but I know what I mean and trust you @Diogenese will immediately understand.

In the real world based upon this limited knowledge the likelihood of interference at greater distances causing a problem will be less than at shorter distances as many more pulses will be engaged at distance as the objects are becoming closer.

The amazing Brembo braking break through whereby stopping distances are dramatically reduced would be of assistance as it would allow more time on every occasion that there is a need to brake for the Lidar to send and receive many more pulses of light.

My opinion only DYOR
FF

AKIDA BALLISTA

3 seconds at 50 kph is about 41 metres. Or 80 metres at closing speed of 2 cars.

 

[Diogenese]

I’m trying to recall the name of the European AI advisory board to check if they were in that list which was pretty influential as they were trying to establish industry standards for adas cars but I can’t find them.

The European AI Alliance?

https://ec.europa.eu/futurium/en/eu-ai-alliance.html

 

[Stable Genius]

The European AI Alliance?

https://ec.europa.eu/futurium/en/eu-ai-alliance.html

Spot on, impressive as usual Dio!

I was lost down a different rabbit hole.

From memory the group had some organisations we were involved with so I’m thinking Valeo. Bosch was another.

I’ll see if I can find that list again.

If we could become the industry standard it would be beyond awesome; and there’s a possibility it could happen.

Cheers

 

[Fact Finder]

3 seconds at 50 kph is about 14 metres. Or 28 metres at closing speed of 2 car ... a cricket pitch plus Warnie's runup.

Let's hope radar has improved since the 70s.

Can radar improve?

Certainly the first reading was correct the three seconds was to allow for human error and to ensure they were tracking the correct vehicle within the beam as well as to allow for any initial or ongoing interference.

If they had put three operators side by side they most likely could have done away with the three seconds and gone with two out of three.

Some of the challenges early on were based on the idea that the then legal radar detector in the offending vehicle had caused a false reading however those attempts were unsuccessful.

Also at 200 metres there are quite a few cricket pitches before the need to brake in the event that it has detected a brick wall across the road arises.

My opinion only DYOR
FF

AKIDA BALLISTA

 

[Diogenese]

Can radar improve?

Certainly the first reading was correct the three seconds was to allow for human error and to ensure they were tracking the correct vehicle within the beam as well as to allow for any initial or ongoing interference.

If they had put three operators side by side they most likely could have done away with the three seconds and gone with two out of three.

Some of the challenges early on were based on the idea that the then legal radar detector in the offending vehicle had caused a false reading however those attempts were unsuccessful.

Also at 200 metres there are quite a few cricket pitches before the need to brake in the event that it has detected a brick wall across the road arises.

My opinion only DYOR
FF

AKIDA BALLISTA

There have been enormous improvements in radar over the last 50 years.
https://www.pasternack.com/t-Radar-Technology-Advancements-and-New-Applications.aspx

ULTRA-WIDE BANDWIDTH MILLIMETER WAVE RADAR

To avoid the spectrum congestion at lower microwave frequencies, and to achieve high-precision and high resolution capabilities many applications have moved beyond 20 GHz. Fortunately, at millimeter wave frequencies there are several frequency bands that are designated with 0.5 GHz, 1 GHz and even 4 GHz of available bandwidth. Radiation at millimeter wave frequencies tends to suffer higher atmospheric losses, but is more directional than at sub-6 GHz microwave frequencies. Millimeter wave radars benefit from reduced noise, greater resolution due to ultra wide bandwidths, and reduced size.8

Many of the latest automobile radars leverage the 79 GHz millimeter wave frequency band that can penetrate sufficiently in adverse conditions, such as fog, dust and rain that are impenetrable by optical sensors (see Figure 2). Operation in this band also enables increased resolution and better hazard detection features. The benefits of millimeter wave radar translate to other applications as well, including detection and surveillance of UAS/drones and even medical monitoring. For example, multi-channel radar for perimeter surveillance (MCRPS) and scanning surveillance radar systems (SSRS) using FMCW principals, with 1 GHz of bandwidth and 100 mW at 94 GHz, have been used to achieve 15 cm range resolution and classification of UAS/drones based on their rotor typologies. Also, 24 GHz band radar has been used in remote heart rate monitors able to discriminate and characterize a heartbeat accurately and efficiently with less than 7.17 ms of RMS error.9

 

[Fact Finder]

There have been enormous improvements in radar over the last 50 years.
https://www.pasternack.com/t-Radar-Technology-Advancements-and-New-Applications.aspx

ULTRA-WIDE BANDWIDTH MILLIMETER WAVE RADAR

To avoid the spectrum congestion at lower microwave frequencies, and to achieve high-precision and high resolution capabilities many applications have moved beyond 20 GHz. Fortunately, at millimeter wave frequencies there are several frequency bands that are designated with 0.5 GHz, 1 GHz and even 4 GHz of available bandwidth. Radiation at millimeter wave frequencies tends to suffer higher atmospheric losses, but is more directional than at sub-6 GHz microwave frequencies. Millimeter wave radars benefit from reduced noise, greater resolution due to ultra wide bandwidths, and reduced size.8

Many of the latest automobile radars leverage the 79 GHz millimeter wave frequency band that can penetrate sufficiently in adverse conditions, such as fog, dust and rain that are impenetrable by optical sensors (see Figure 2). Operation in this band also enables increased resolution and better hazard detection features. The benefits of millimeter wave radar translate to other applications as well, including detection and surveillance of UAS/drones and even medical monitoring. For example, multi-channel radar for perimeter surveillance (MCRPS) and scanning surveillance radar systems (SSRS) using FMCW principals, with 1 GHz of bandwidth and 100 mW at 94 GHz, have been used to achieve 15 cm range resolution and classification of UAS/drones based on their rotor typologies. Also, 24 GHz band radar has been used in remote heart rate monitors able to discriminate and characterize a heartbeat accurately and efficiently with less than 7.17 ms of RMS error.9

Hi @Diogenese
Can you not hear me thinking aloud what I was referring to is the speed at which the radar transmission moves through the air over a given distance has that changed?
FF.

AKIDA BALLISTA

 

[Fact Finder]

Hi @Diogenese
Can you not hear me thinking aloud what I was referring to is the speed at which the radar transmission moves through the air over a given distance has that changed?
FF.

AKIDA BALLISTA

Also the return speeds after detecting the object have they improved? FF

 

[Diogenese]

Hi @Diogenese
Can you not hear me thinking aloud what I was referring to is the speed at which the radar transmission moves through the air over a given distance has that changed?
FF.

AKIDA BALLISTA

Just like Warnie's flipper/doozera, you'd be surprised.

See this from the venerable Daily Mail:
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/science...w-theory-completely-change-view-universe.html

Was Einstein WRONG about the speed of light? New theory could completely change our view of the universe​

• Albert Einstein believed the speed of light was constant in a vacuum
• This constant has formed the basis of many theories in modern physics
• But the model of inflation leaves a conundrum called the Horizon Problem
• Physicists believe that light may have travelled faster in the early universe, before slowing to present levels, which could be tested with observations

 

[Fact Finder]

Just like Warnie's flipper/doozera, you'd be surprised.

See this from the venerable Daily Mail:
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/science...w-theory-completely-change-view-universe.html

Was Einstein WRONG about the speed of light? New theory could completely change our view of the universe​

• Albert Einstein believed the speed of light was constant in a vacuum
• This constant has formed the basis of many theories in modern physics
• But the model of inflation leaves a conundrum called the Horizon Problem
• Physicists believe that light may have travelled faster in the early universe, before slowing to present levels, which could be tested with observations

Hi @Diogenese
I actually read about that in a more credible place than the Daily Mail a little while back and it was saying that this was still very much a theory and at this point in time Einstein has not yet been shown to be wrong. Then again Einstein was working in a second vacuum being the time frame of his own existence and to that extent his measurement of the speed of light as a constant may always be correct within those two vacuums. It is all relative after all.

So I think from this you are saying to me that the speed of a radar signal everything else being equal is still the same as it was 50 years ago. I will ignore its speed 5 billion years ago.

The improvements that have occurred as to narrower bandwidth etc; have improved accuracy and security but not the amount of time needed to send and receive the information from which the presence of an object can be detected and identified.

The need which AKIDA technology is addressing is the latency involved between the receipt of the return signal and the processing of same into actionable meta data. By doing this right at the sensor the optimum time taken is achieved.

Or am I completely wrong?

My opinion only DYOR
FF

AKIDA BALLISTA
PS: That linked article was very interesting and filled in some gaps that I had regarding the later radar and now LiDAR systems being used by the Police. Many thanks.

 

[Taproot]

I had a quick look at Magna and they are linked with a lot of car manufactures. One would think a company of this size has taken a look at Brainchip and tested what it can do. I note Ford and TATA are amongst their customers. I do recall hearing/reading something about them previously but I’m still jogging my memory to remember where?


Global Customer Value

We have deep systems knowledge and supply 58 OEMs. Our products and systems are on two out of every three vehicles launched around the world through 2019 and Magna is the only automotive supplier in the world with expertise in the whole vehicle – from electronics to body to powertrain to complete vehicle manufacturing.

Click the selections below to view our list of customers around the world.

OEM
• Aston Martin
• BAIC Motor
• Beijing Automobile Works
• BMW
• Borgward
• Brilliance China
• BYD
• Canoo
• Changan Auto
• Chery
• CNH Industrial
• Cowin
• Daimler
• Dongfeng Honda
• Dongfeng Limited
• Dongfeng Motors
• Enovate
• FAW
• FAW Volkswagen
• Ferrari
• Fisker
• Force Motors
• Ford Motor
• Future Mobility
• GAC Honda
• GAC Motor
• GAC NIO
• GAZ
• Geely Group
• General Motors
• Great Wall Automobile
• Haima Zhengzhou
• Honda Motor
• Human Horizons
• Hyundai Motor
• INEOS
• Isuzu Motor
• Jianghuai
• Lixiang
• Lucid Motors
• Mahindra & Mahindra
• Mazda Motor
• McLaren Cars
• NIO
• Qoros
• Renault-Nissan-Mitsubishi
• Rivian Automotive
• SAIC Motor
• SAIC-GM-Wuling
• South-east Automobile
• Stellantis
• Subaru
• Suzuki Motor
• Tata
• Toyota Motor
• Vinfast
• Volkswagen
• WM Motor
• Xiaopeng

Cheers

Maybe something like this ?

Nviso + Seeing Machines

NVISO and Seeing Machines to Bring Human Behaviour AI to Automotive World

NVISO and Seeing Machines to demonstrate Advanced Driver Monitoring System for detecting Driver Emotion at AI Expo 2020 in Tokyo, Japan

www.nviso.ai

Seeing Machines + Magna

Seeing Machines and Magna collaborate on fully integrated driver monitoring and mirror solution

Seeing Machines, an Australia-based advanced computer vision technology company that designs AI-powered operator monitoring systems to improve transport safety, has collaborated with automotive Tie…

www.automotiveinteriorsworld.com

Magna are 3rd largest Auto supplier behind Bosch and Denso
I think there would be many dots you could pursue to put Magna in the mix.
That's why everyone keeps using "Akida" and "Ubiquitous" in the same sentence

 

[Deleted member 118]

Maybe something like this ?

Nviso + Seeing Machines

NVISO and Seeing Machines to Bring Human Behaviour AI to Automotive World

NVISO and Seeing Machines to demonstrate Advanced Driver Monitoring System for detecting Driver Emotion at AI Expo 2020 in Tokyo, Japan

www.nviso.ai

Seeing Machines + Magna

Seeing Machines and Magna collaborate on fully integrated driver monitoring and mirror solution

Seeing Machines, an Australia-based advanced computer vision technology company that designs AI-powered operator monitoring systems to improve transport safety, has collaborated with automotive Tie…

www.automotiveinteriorsworld.com

Magna are 3rd largest Auto supplier behind Bosch and Denso
I think there would be many dots you could pursue to put Magna in the mix.
That's why everyone keeps using "Akida" and "Ubiquitous" in the same sentence

The First 4D Imaging Radar-on-a-Chip Developed by Texas-based Startup 'Uhnder' Will Debut on Vehicles in 2022

Austin, Texas-based digital radar startup Uhnder, a developer of 4D imaging radar technology for automotive and next-generation mobility applications, will soon become the first company to mass produce an automotive-grade, 4D digital imaging radar-on-chip to support next-generation advanced...

m.futurecar.com

Magna International Acquires Optimus Ride Engineering Team

Magna, a major automotive technology supplier, has acquired self-driving shuttle developer Optimus Ride and will add its employees to its driver-assist efforts.

www.robotics247.com

 

[Proga]

Spot on, impressive as usual Dio!

I was lost down a different rabbit hole.

From memory the group had some organisations we were involved with so I’m thinking Valeo. Bosch was another.

I’ll see if I can find that list again.

If we could become the industry standard it would be beyond awesome; and there’s a possibility it could happen.

Cheers

SG,

If we could become the industry standard it would be beyond awesome; and there’s a possibility it could happen - I think it already is. The most surprising aspect of the conversion of ICE vehicles to electric is the speed of the rollout. There are no clear winners or losers yet but everybody is desperately fighting for market share to be on the right side of the ledger.

BRN's nearest competition is years away. No vehicle company has time to wait or they risk becoming a loser. It has the potential to be the beginning of the end for Tesla if they're not careful. Especially with Musk distracted by Twitter.

Tesla Autopilot Stirs U.S. Alarm as ‘Disaster Waiting to Happen’​

Regulators are scrutinizing Tesla’s driver-assistance system more than ever, pointing to a potential crackdown that could alarm investors and consumers.

Tesla Autopilot Stirs U.S. Alarm as ‘Disaster Waiting to Happen’

Regulators are scrutinizing Tesla’s driver-assistance system more than ever, pointing to a potential crackdown that could alarm investors and consumers.

www.bloomberg.com

 

[Diogenese]

Hi @Diogenese
I actually read about that in a more credible place than the Daily Mail a little while back and it was saying that this was still very much a theory and at this point in time Einstein has not yet been shown to be wrong. Then again Einstein was working in a second vacuum being the time frame of his own existence and to that extent his measurement of the speed of light as a constant may always be correct within those two vacuums. It is all relative after all.

So I think from this you are saying to me that the speed of a radar signal everything else being equal is still the same as it was 50 years ago. I will ignore its speed 5 billion years ago.

The improvements that have occurred as to narrower bandwidth etc; have improved accuracy and security but not the amount of time needed to send and receive the information from which the presence of an object can be detected and identified.

The need which AKIDA technology is addressing is the latency involved between the receipt of the return signal and the processing of same into actionable meta data. By doing this right at the sensor the optimum time taken is achieved.

Or am I completely wrong?

My opinion only DYOR
FF

AKIDA BALLISTA
PS: That linked article was very interesting and filled in some gaps that I had regarding the later radar and now LiDAR systems being used by the Police. Many thanks.

Now, here's a thing:

Air, as opposed to a vacuum, has a different refractive index from the refractive index of a vacuum. Nominal refractive index for air is 1.000273 compared to 1 for a vacuum.

The speed of light in a medium is inversely proportional to its refractive index.

But the refractive index is dependent on wavelength. That is to say, different wavelengths meet different "resistance" in the same medium. This means that different wavelengths travel at different speeds in the same medium, eg, air. Think of a prism.

So increasing the frequency (reducing the wavelength) of radar transmissions means the shorter wavelength (higher frequency) radar signals do travel faster than the longer wavelength radar waves of yore. But you'd need to be quick with a stopwatch to measure the difference over a 200 m roundtrip.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Refractive_index#Dispersion

The refractive index of materials varies with the wavelength (and frequency) of light.[28] This is called dispersion and causes prisms and rainbows to divide white light into its constituent spectral colors.[29] As the refractive index varies with wavelength, so will the refraction angle as light goes from one material to another. Dispersion also causes the focal length of lenses to be wavelength dependent. This is a type of chromatic aberration, which often needs to be corrected for in imaging systems. In regions of the spectrum where the material does not absorb light, the refractive index tends to decrease with increasing wavelength, and thus increase with frequency. This is called "normal dispersion", in contrast to "anomalous dispersion", where the refractive index increases with wavelength.[28] For visible light normal dispersion means that the refractive index is higher for blue light than for red.

 

[Deleted member 118]

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=sLlm7K6QK-8

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=tb47bUlKPec

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=2kMjQmZafxE

Shed loads more videos on YouTube for this event

 

[Fact Finder]

Now, here's a thing:

Air, as opposed to a vacuum, has a different refractive index from the refractive index of a vacuum. Nominal refractive index for air is 1.000273 compared to 1 for a vacuum.

The speed of light in a medium is inversely proportional to its refractive index.

But the refractive index is dependent on wavelength. That is to say, different wavelengths meet different "resistance" in the same medium. This means that different wavelengths travel at different speeds in the same medium, eg, air. Think of a prism.

So increasing the frequency (reducing the wavelength) of radar transmissions means the shorter wavelength (higher frequency) radar signals do travel faster than the longer wavelength radar waves of yore. But you'd need to be quick with a stopwatch to measure the difference over a 200 m roundtrip.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Refractive_index#Dispersion

The refractive index of materials varies with the wavelength (and frequency) of light.[28] This is called dispersion and causes prisms and rainbows to divide white light into its constituent spectral colors.[29] As the refractive index varies with wavelength, so will the refraction angle as light goes from one material to another. Dispersion also causes the focal length of lenses to be wavelength dependent. This is a type of chromatic aberration, which often needs to be corrected for in imaging systems. In regions of the spectrum where the material does not absorb light, the refractive index tends to decrease with increasing wavelength, and thus increase with frequency. This is called "normal dispersion", in contrast to "anomalous dispersion", where the refractive index increases with wavelength.[28] For visible light normal dispersion means that the refractive index is higher for blue light than for red.

Final annoying question assuming you gave AKIDA a stopwatch going back to our original discussion of LiDAR could it ignore those pulses not travelling at the correct speed ie; the pen laser fired directly into the middle of the sensor?

FF

AKIDA BALLISTA

 

[Taproot]

The First 4D Imaging Radar-on-a-Chip Developed by Texas-based Startup 'Uhnder' Will Debut on Vehicles in 2022

Austin, Texas-based digital radar startup Uhnder, a developer of 4D imaging radar technology for automotive and next-generation mobility applications, will soon become the first company to mass produce an automotive-grade, 4D digital imaging radar-on-chip to support next-generation advanced...

m.futurecar.com

Magna International Acquires Optimus Ride Engineering Team

Magna, a major automotive technology supplier, has acquired self-driving shuttle developer Optimus Ride and will add its employees to its driver-assist efforts.

www.robotics247.com

 

[Pmel]

Could we be part of it?