AVZ Discussion 2022

[BRICK]

 

[Peterg]

View attachment 33614

Funny

 

[obe wan]

That neither did speaks volumes.
We still need $240m for development

Considering LTR is 20mt measured / 109mt infered , strip ratio 8:1 ; bulk will be underground mining , so recovery factor will be pretty shite and Albemarle hit them with a $5.5billion offer......then you have 24% of Manono ; which essentially is going to be 24% of Carrier or 24% of the entire tenement of well in excess of 1 billion tonne....for $240m ( with further payments) I reckon there's better deals out there than CATH

 

[ptlas]

Considering LTR is 20mt measured / 109mt infered , strip ratio 8:1 ; bulk will be underground mining , so recovery factor will be pretty shite and Albemarle hit them with a $5.5billion offer......then you have 24% of Manono ; which essentially is going to be 24% of Carrier or 24% of the entire tenement of well in excess of 1 billion tonne....for $240m ( with further payments) I reckon there's better deals out there than CATH

Certainly.
But not before ML imo.
We're not in WA

 

[DoubleA]

ok, but you said 'we would be well financed to continue operations and defend these challenges for years with the $240 million'

fact is that this $240m is for project development and not for AVZ operations or legal funds; the funds are for mining infrastructure , long lead time purchase agreements etc .. not sure CATH would be totally fine AVZ sitting back without a ML, using the cash for other purposes outside its actual intent.

As you say, 'If the mining license is granted then the issues are likely substantially resolved anyway' - yes and CATH probably thought that there was little risk considering AVZ had their technical applications ticked off...but obviously something changed which put the skids under that and the reins were pulled.

The risk aversion dial is a personal thing, dependent on how a win or lose effects ones or the company's (and its shareholders) financial situation.

i reckon this is one area which OMNI would have delved into if things went tits up

AVZ's operations ARE to develop the project. The exact capex/opex split or any detailed requirements have not been released by AVZ.

An extra $240 million of a liquid financial assets improves AVZ's flexibility.

Having an extra $240 million to continue to develop the project frees up other funds NOT included in that $240 million, to be spent on other things such as legal costs if required.

 

[obe wan]

AVZ's operations ARE to develop the project. The exact capex/opex split or any detailed requirements have not been released by AVZ.

An extra $240 million of a liquid financial assets improves AVZ's flexibility.

Having an extra $240 million to continue to develop the project frees up other funds NOT included in that $240 million, to be spent on other things such as legal costs if required.

CAPEX costs on a 4.5mtpa plant was at $545m about two years ago ; that figure will now be closer to about $650-700m ;expectations / rumours are that AVZ will go for a 10mtpa plant off the bat, so realistically it will be over a billion and cash is now more expensive ; won't operate straight up at that nameplate, but will get the bulk of the plant up and progressively ramp it.

I've been involved in a number of large scale mining projects from precontracts through procurements stages and into construct ; $240m will get eaten up on CAPEX within a few months, they’ll burn that in about 8 months ; $240m into a $800m++ bill, particularly when they now need to rapidly accelerate the project, they won't notice that money coming in through the front door and out through the back.

AVZ is not Dathcom, CATHs $240m is to DATHCOM, not AVZ, AVZ will need to find some cash of their own ; without a ML they’d struggle to raise capital and I very much doubt that Mr Pei would allow AVZ to put down assets generated through his funding injection into Dathcom as security again debt funds

 

[LX600]

CAPEX costs on a 4.5mtpa plant was at $545m about two years ago ; that figure will now be closer to about $650-700m ;expectations / rumours are that AVZ will go for a 10mtpa plant off the bat, so realistically it will be over a billion and cash is now more expensive ; won't operate straight up at that nameplate, but will get the bulk of the plant up and progressively ramp it.

I've been involved in a number of large scale mining projects from precontracts through procurements stages and into construct ; $240m will get eaten up on CAPEX within a few months, they’ll burn that in about 8 months ; $240m into a $800m++ bill, particularly when they now need to rapidly accelerate the project, they won't notice that money coming in through the front door and out through the back.

AVZ is not Dathcom, CATHs $240m is to DATHCOM, not AVZ, AVZ will need to find some cash of their own ; without a ML they’d struggle to raise capital and I very much doubt that Mr Pei would allow AVZ to put down assets generated through his funding injection into Dathcom as security again debt funds

Cath $240m is to AVZ not dathcom

 

[DoubleA]

CAPEX costs on a 4.5mtpa plant was at $545m about two years ago ; that figure will now be closer to about $650-700m ;expectations / rumours are that AVZ will go for a 10mtpa plant off the bat, so realistically it will be over a billion and cash is now more expensive ; won't operate straight up at that nameplate, but will get the bulk of the plant up and progressively ramp it.

I've been involved in a number of large scale mining projects from precontracts through procurements stages and into construct ; $240m will get eaten up on CAPEX within a few months, they’ll burn that in about 8 months ; $240m into a $800m++ bill, particularly when they now need to rapidly accelerate the project, they won't notice that money coming in through the front door and out through the back.

AVZ is not Dathcom, CATHs $240m is to DATHCOM, not AVZ, AVZ will need to find some cash of their own ; without a ML they’d struggle to raise capital and I very much doubt that Mr Pei would allow AVZ to put down assets generated through his funding injection into Dathcom as security again debt funds

You are misunderstanding what I am saying.

AVZ are not going to spend $500m+ without the mining license. If the mining license is granted then the issues are substantially resolved anyway.

I am referring to a situation (the current situation) where the mining license has NOT been granted. I would like:

- AVZ not to be the only one who loses out big time if the project goes south
- Increased influence through investment of a powerful partner
- AVZ not running down to the last dollar and running the risk of becoming insolvent

 

[wombat74]

CAPEX costs on a 4.5mtpa plant was at $545m about two years ago ; that figure will now be closer to about $650-700m ;expectations / rumours are that AVZ will go for a 10mtpa plant off the bat, so realistically it will be over a billion and cash is now more expensive ; won't operate straight up at that nameplate, but will get the bulk of the plant up and progressively ramp it.

I've been involved in a number of large scale mining projects from precontracts through procurements stages and into construct ; $240m will get eaten up on CAPEX within a few months, they’ll burn that in about 8 months ; $240m into a $800m++ bill, particularly when they now need to rapidly accelerate the project, they won't notice that money coming in through the front door and out through the back.

AVZ is not Dathcom, CATHs $240m is to DATHCOM, not AVZ, AVZ will need to find some cash of their own ; without a ML they’d struggle to raise capital and I very much doubt that Mr Pei would allow AVZ to put down assets generated through his funding injection into Dathcom as security again debt funds

Isn't CATH putting up around $500mil . $24O MIL FOR 24% and the rest towards construction . Nigel also mentioned another $500 mil through African lenders ready to go . Money not an issue .

 

[Samus]

AVZ is not Dathcom, CATHs $240m is to DATHCOM, not AVZ, AVZ will need to find some cash of their own ; without a ML they’d struggle to raise capital and I very much doubt that Mr Pei would allow AVZ to put down assets generated through his funding injection into Dathcom as security again debt funds

I'm sorry I'm confused by this, isn't CATH buying 24% out of AVZ's 75% share of Dathcom?
They're buying a percentage of Dathcom from AVZ and paying AVZ for it.
CATH also need to stump up their percentage of capex costs while AVZ uses the 240 mil as part of ours.
As far as my understanding what you've said above is wrong.

 

[Samus]

There is also a troll saying that's a different man with the same name but it sure looks like him ...

 

[CashKing]

FUCK …..

Here I am trying to decide Lamb or Fish for dinner


GLTAH

 

[Charbella]

Here figure it out this way ; the 240m is for 24% of the project ; the project is Dathcom ; does AVZ register get diluted?... Answer is no, why? Because it's 24% of Dathcom, not AVZ

Our ownership in Dathcom will reduce from 75% to 51%, in exchange for $240mil. What’s the confusion?

 

[LX600]

Here figure it out this way ; the 240m is for 24% of the project ; the project is Dathcom ; does AVZ register get diluted?... Answer is no, why? Because it's 24% of Dathcom, not AVZ

You can think the share is an asset AVZ held. So Avz using the share of Dathcom to exchange $240m

 

[Winenut]

Here figure it out this way ; the 240m is for 24% of the project ; the project is Dathcom ; does AVZ register get diluted?... Answer is no, why? Because it's 24% of Dathcom, not AVZ

100%....staggering that some don't get the whole kit and kaboodle in this whole Manono equation is fucking Dathcom.

That's where the ML lies....that's where the money and power and interest and every other players eyes are......corrupt or otherwise

 

[Winenut]

FUCK …..

Here I am trying to decide Lamb or Fish for dinner


GLTAH

Go the fish....but no squid at Brighton again today

I just can't get there at the right time.....wife and kids preclude the perfect fishing time.....bless 'em!

 

[Azzler]

There is also a troll saying that's a different man with the same name but it sure looks like him ...

Nah, google around a litle bit.
It looks like whoever wrote the article about Tantalex used a picture of the wrong guy by the same name, wouldnt be the first lazy journalism picture woopsie.
So yes the guy in the picture of the article IS the Yves on Twitter, but it's not the Tantalex Yves.
Weird tho.

 

[Samus]

Nah, google around a litle bit.
It looks like whoever wrote the article about Tantalex used a picture of the wrong guy by the same name, wouldnt be the first lazy journalism picture woopsie.
So yes the guy in the picture of the article IS the Yves on Twitter, but it's not the Tantalex Yves.
Weird tho.

Yeah was just reading the same, wierd indeed. Can't tell the crooks from the other crooks.

 

[obe wan]

Isn't CATH putting up around $500mil . $24O MIL FOR 24% and the rest towards construction . Nigel also mentioned another $500 mil through African lenders ready to go . Money not an issue .

Yes I know cash isn't an issue, but old mate reckons that CATH should hoof over $240m without the licence and AVZ can live off that and pay it's legal fees for years to come

“we would be well financed to continue operations and defend these challenges for years with the $240 million.”

FFS, the project needs to be accelerated and $240m is the tip of the iceberg of what needs to be stumped up in order to get the project to commissioning stage. Expecting CATH to hand over 240m without ML so we keep the lights on and keep the lawyers coffers full is bollox ; Dathcom can't erect any process plant until the ML is granted ; CATs balance of payment above the $240m doesn't get released until construction operations are advanced.

Yes CATHs input is around that 450m mark and yes African Development bank are supposedly going to fund in the region on $500m; surprise surprise this amounts to around the figure of $1b CAPEX required to build the plant infrastructure dry; the plant would take around 2 years to build..

DoubleA says

I am referring to a situation (the current situation) where the mining license has NOT been granted. I would like: ( short story - Cath to pay up the $240m pre ML ; why -

- AVZ not to be the only one who loses out big time if the project goes south -----Gofundme -CATH $240m
- Increased influence through investment of a powerful partner -- Goriskme -CATH $240m
- AVZ not running down to the last dollar and running the risk of becoming insolvent- GonotCatsissue - as currently own 0% of the project

DoubleA, if Cath dished up the $240m which was initialy for mine development costs, but we obviously don't have a licence and so it can't go towards mining development costs, but we keep the lights on for years and pay the lawyers well ; will CAT refill that Jar and play let's forget..not a chance

 

[Charbella]

“we would be well financed to continue operations and defend these challenges for years with the $240 million.”

FFS, the project needs to be accelerated and $240m is the tip of the iceberg of what needs to be stumped up in order to get the project to commissioning stage. Expecting CATH to hand over 240m without ML so we keep the lights on and keep the lawyers coffers full is bollox ; Dathcom can't erect any process plant until the ML is granted ; CATs balance of payment above the $240m doesn't get released until construction operations are advanced.

Yes CATHs input is around that 450m mark and yes African Development bank are supposedly going to fund in the region on $500m; surprise surprise this amounts to around the figure of $1b CAPEX required to build the plant infrastructure dry; the plant would take around 2 years to build..

DoubleA says

I am referring to a situation (the current situation) where the mining license has NOT been granted. I would like: ( short story - Cath to pay up the $240m pre ML ; why -

- AVZ not to be the only one who loses out big time if the project goes south -----Gofundme -CATH $240m
- Increased influence through investment of a powerful partner -- Goriskme -CATH $240m
- AVZ not running down to the last dollar and running the risk of becoming insolvent- GonotCatsissue - as currently own 0% of the project

DoubleA, if Cath dished up the $240m which was initialy for mine development costs, but we obviously don't have a licence and so it can't go towards mining development costs, but we keep the lights on for years and pay the lawyers well ; will CAT refill that Jar and play let's forget..not a chance