AVZ Discussion 2022
- Thread starter GazDix
- Start date
The ICSID does not directly enforce penalties , but instead relies on the legal system of it's states to recognize and enforce as if they were final judgments of their domestic courts. Meaning that a party seeking to enforce an award must go through the relevant member state to collect any fines imposed .This enforcement is subject to the states laws on sovereign immunity . In other words if the DRC court refuses to recognize the ICSID decision there is little chance AVZ will see a dollar . This tells us a settlement needs to be reached before the first ICSID court date in June. If not we can assume the DRC do not recognize the ICSID
A party seeking recognition or enforcement in a Member State must provide a copy of the Award certified by the Secretary-General to a competent court (or other authority which the State has designated for this purpose (ICSID/8)). Certified copies are sent to the parties on the date of dispatch of the Award, and the parties may request additional copies at any time.
Although Member States must recognize and enforce the Award, each State’s laws relating to sovereign immunity from execution continue to apply (Article 55 of the ICSID Convention).
ICSID has no formal role in recognition and enforcement of an Award under the ICSID Convention. However, if a party informs ICSID of the other party’s non-compliance with an Award, it is ICSID’s practice to contact the non-complying party to request information on the steps that party has taken, or will take, to comply with the Award.
Btw, DRC is a member state of ICSID.
icsid.worldbank.org
Have a good one Shane
Member States | ICSID
There are significant advantages to becoming a member of ICSID. Member States and their nationals obtain access to investment dispute settlement under the ICSID Convention and the Additional Facility, as well as to the facilities and expert services of the Secretariat.
Have a good one Shane
thegh0stwithin
Regular
I read that as pay up or lose the benefits, which outweigh potential losses of being open and honest and sharing the fruits of planning and backing of AVZ, as well as the blood, sweat and tears of Manono - the alternative is far more ugly than granting a ML and revoking 13359 from the Zijin subsidiary and returning it to AVZ.Btw, DRC is a member state of ICSID.
Member States | ICSID
There are significant advantages to becoming a member of ICSID. Member States and their nationals obtain access to investment dispute settlement under the ICSID Convention and the Additional Facility, as well as to the facilities and expert services of the Secretariat.
Have a good one Shane
Haven't they got enough wars to fight, without starting wars with people that just wanted to grow with them?
Consider the M23 movement and said reason for it, and FT should be asking himself if he is not willingly creating disorder and resistance in an area of his country that is currently compliant and cohesive with the capital.
Tread carefully.
What wars?
I reckon Felix and cohorts are too busy lining their pockets to notice how deep they are in the shit.
That's why their army is underpaid and probably will turn on him, if he and his merry band of kleptomaniacs don't shoot through quick enough on a government plane, but where can they go other than China?
Those within the DRC government who accepted bribes are now compromised . Quite probable they have been offered sweeteners into the future if they follow CCP orders . Criminals and gangsters will always put self preservation and self interest ahead of what is right . Maybe a deal can be struck with Cath in the picture , but it has to happen before the ICSID trial begins .
I’ve been thinking what this could all mean for AVZ. And I honestly don’t have a clue. I don’t think it’s a good thing.
Separately, I’m worried China might deploy troops in some capacity to protect its strategic interests if this gets out of hand. PRC hasn’t done this sort of thing though so unsure. But it’s an unease on me that if this grows so will support for DRC from China.
Separately, I’m worried China might deploy troops in some capacity to protect its strategic interests if this gets out of hand. PRC hasn’t done this sort of thing though so unsure. But it’s an unease on me that if this grows so will support for DRC from China.
Mute22
Regular
Happy 1000-Day Milestone, Everyone!
It’s hard to believe, but today marks 1,000 days since AVZ officially went into suspension.
With the soaring cost of living, skyrocketing house prices, and stagnant wage growth across many industries in Australia, I can’t help but wonder how many families, children, and relatives have had their lives irreversibly impacted by this situation. Sometimes I reflect on 2022 as a crossroads in my life, wondering if I chose the wrong path. But this journey isn’t over yet, and we are in a better position than the last 999 days.
I’d like to give a heartfelt shoutout to all the amazingly high-effort regulars - Jens, DeBoss, Obe Wan, David, Cumquat, Frank, Cruiser—too many to name really, who’ve tirelessly kept up the public fight in the interest of all shareholders. I truly appreciate your efforts. On days when I’ve lacked the mental or emotional energy to stay engaged, seeing your drive and consistency for justice has been a real source of inspiration.
Of course, I also want to thank Nigel and the Board of Directors for navigating what must be one of the most challenging periods of their lives. Facing down three hostile governments (their own included), relentless shareholders, dishonest journalists, slippery characters like Carrick tarnishing their reputations, and corporate giants trying to outmaneuver them, all while having their hands tied, as the only party actually playing by the rules - to say it can't have been easy would be an understatement.
It’s been one hell of a journey, and through it, I’ve discovered a level of resilience I never knew I had. So if anything, there's that.
The finish line feels closer than ever. There’s a shift in the air, and I believe the end of this saga is on the horizon. It’s been a tough road, but I’m hopeful that soon we’ll finally see the closure, and the justice we’ve all been waiting for.
It’s hard to believe, but today marks 1,000 days since AVZ officially went into suspension.
With the soaring cost of living, skyrocketing house prices, and stagnant wage growth across many industries in Australia, I can’t help but wonder how many families, children, and relatives have had their lives irreversibly impacted by this situation. Sometimes I reflect on 2022 as a crossroads in my life, wondering if I chose the wrong path. But this journey isn’t over yet, and we are in a better position than the last 999 days.
I’d like to give a heartfelt shoutout to all the amazingly high-effort regulars - Jens, DeBoss, Obe Wan, David, Cumquat, Frank, Cruiser—too many to name really, who’ve tirelessly kept up the public fight in the interest of all shareholders. I truly appreciate your efforts. On days when I’ve lacked the mental or emotional energy to stay engaged, seeing your drive and consistency for justice has been a real source of inspiration.
Of course, I also want to thank Nigel and the Board of Directors for navigating what must be one of the most challenging periods of their lives. Facing down three hostile governments (their own included), relentless shareholders, dishonest journalists, slippery characters like Carrick tarnishing their reputations, and corporate giants trying to outmaneuver them, all while having their hands tied, as the only party actually playing by the rules - to say it can't have been easy would be an understatement.
It’s been one hell of a journey, and through it, I’ve discovered a level of resilience I never knew I had. So if anything, there's that.
The finish line feels closer than ever. There’s a shift in the air, and I believe the end of this saga is on the horizon. It’s been a tough road, but I’m hopeful that soon we’ll finally see the closure, and the justice we’ve all been waiting for.
TheCount
Regular
The main reason for traffic congestion in Kinshasa is corruption, from traffic cops thru to the judiciary:
https://theconversation.com/kinshas...ing-five-times-more-revenue-than-fines-246786
Imagine the judiciary being asked to endorse international penalties lol. Wont happen. Hard to escape the notion now that the DRC is a failed state. Best we settle and GTFO. IMO.
Kinshasa’s traffic cops run an extortion scheme generating five times more revenue than fines
https://theconversation.com/kinshas...ing-five-times-more-revenue-than-fines-246786
Imagine the judiciary being asked to endorse international penalties lol. Wont happen. Hard to escape the notion now that the DRC is a failed state. Best we settle and GTFO. IMO.
Yeah I've been wondering the same.
China is always looking for chances to increase its influence, and in the current era that could include militarily. If DRC accepted, they could legitimately use the conflict as a reason to bring in troops.
The big question is how that changes dynamics for everything else once it happens....
For us I dont think its a problem due to our partnership with CATH now, but it would certainly push things in new directions so who knows..
RHyNO
Regular
I love this country! We make a strategic mineral list. Pay a whole bunch of consultants and politicians to create it. Then when a company comes along from a foreign nation (one we are paying 300 billion just to get submarines to protect us from) we let them not only pillage what we have in Africa but also let them in our front door to own the critical minerals we need. We hand them the keys!!!!! All the politicians in this country on both sides need to WAKE THE FUCK UP!!
Carlos Danger
Top 20
Wrong. We can enforce it in any member state.
https://icsid.worldbank.org/procedures/arbitration/convention/recognition-enforcement
Recognition and Enforcement - ICSID Convention Arbitration (2022 Rules)
An Award of a Tribunal is binding on all parties to the proceeding and each party must comply with it pursuant to its terms (Article 53(1) of the ICSID Convention). If a party fails to comply with the Award, the other party can have the pecuniary obligations recognized and enforced in the courts of any ICSID Member State as though it were a final judgment of that State’s courts (Article 54(1) of the ICSID Convention).
Dont the US own the Lobito corridor
Lobito Corridor: a $250 million investment planned by the USA for this rail link between the DRC and Angola
The United States has confirmed that it is considering a $250 million investment in the Lobito rail link between the DRC and Angola. With a length of 1,344 km, the project is a strategic axis
miningandbusiness.com
imo
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