AVZ Discussion 2022

[Onthefm]

Suspect CATH/CATL is the fall back position for CCP, ie only use them when/if Z etc are out of the game



Not really sure who is banned as there are that many missing posts that the thread is hard to follow.
The posts of the two principal culprits are still available.

Seen more trolls this week than a Norwegian potholer would see in a lifetime.

BTW In my post that was moderated yesterday, you quoted two thirds of it back at me - so either you are selectivly using the post or it was altered by third party before you saw it.

If you had read it in it's entirety, you would understand it was a joke aimed at nobody in particular.

I don't know which, beacause as we discussed, moderated posts are not available to the writer to work out what their sins were.

I have posted this publicly, as you closed the discussion immediately after moderation.

BTW your message informing me of the moderation has since been removed.

What the hell is going on?

A.I. = Artificial Ignorance

I wouldn't trust cath one bit he is also run by ccp imo. Remember a bloke called Jack ma thought he could say what he honestly thought. Bad move haven't seen nor heard from him I a while and when we do it will be all praise for the ccp.

 

[Rediah]

I wouldn't trust cath one bit he is also run by ccp imo. Remember a bloke called Jack ma thought he could say what he honestly thought. Bad move haven't seen nor heard from him I a while and when we do it will be all praise for the ccp.

Jack Ma

https://www.news.com.au/finance/work/leaders/jack-ma-takes-up-visiting-professor-post-in-japan/news-story/114d02e4478bb92fc722c91090917037

 

[Carlos Danger]

I wouldn't trust cath one bit he is also run by ccp imo. Remember a bloke called Jack ma thought he could say what he honestly thought. Bad move haven't seen nor heard from him I a while and when we do it will be all praise for the ccp.

Jack Ma

https://www.news.com.au/finance/work/leaders/jack-ma-takes-up-visiting-professor-post-in-japan/news-story/114d02e4478bb92fc722c91090917037

View attachment 37019

Jack spent some time in Room 101 lmao

 

[Xerof]

I wouldn't trust cath one bit he is also run by ccp imo. Remember a bloke called Jack ma thought he could say what he honestly thought. Bad move haven't seen nor heard from him I a while and when we do it will be all praise for the ccp.

A couple of things I have read about CATH/CATL recently, and not so recently, which rang my bells:

• Recently, Xi Ping commented that he had some concern at how quickly CATL was expanding its operations globally. Read as perhaps Z should do this one?
• Not so recently, I read a paper put to a meeting that CATH board held to explain/approve the 24% deal, in which the line that stood out for me was that they had not only secured and re-assigned the Yibin off take, but had increased substantially the amount of off take, AND for over the life of the mine, AND at a 'better' price. This was before the ML fiasco, so I didn't think too much of it, and can't bloody well find it again now. At the time everything was rosy, and thunderbirds were go.
• This second point has never been announced by AVZ, so I'm wondering if it's actually true and been formalised. It could just be their way of getting the deal approved at the local level in China, i have no idea

Anyway, another way to look at all this CATH shit, is to assume AVZ are the ones stalling. I can't rule that out, despite AVZ's calming words to the contrary, especially given CATH waived all the CP's, INCLUDING the necessity for the ML. When the final split was being contested, no way would AVZ want to settle 24%

IMO

 

[Carlos Danger]

Anyway, another way to look at all this CATH shit, is to assume AVZ are the ones stalling. I can't rule that out, despite AVZ's calming words to the contrary, especially given CATH waived all the CP's, INCLUDING the necessity for the ML. When the final split was being contested, no way would AVZ want to settle 24%

AVZ can't sell to CATH while Cominiere are still in Dathcom because they would have pre-emption on the 24% (or 9%). This is also why management can't accept Zijin under any circumstances as they would then have the pre-emption on the CATH deal as their purchase would be considered to have been completed first. That's why the TIA completion keeps getting pushed back imo

 

[cruiser51]

"allowed to happen" is not really fair, I think. All reported posts are reviewed. The thing is, on a forum where debate is not only allowed, but encouraged, it is not always a simple thing for myself to referee a debate I know nothing at all about (I don't follow the AVZ stock). Further, the public forums are a matter of public record and it is actually illegal for me to interject on a basis of picking a 'side' as the regulations clearly imply that would likely be seen some kind of endorsement on my part. And I am not financially licensed to offer such endorsements, whether I mean to or not. Instead, I must have strict rules and require the community to vote for those who break them. I think what you expect from me is an active referee with participant level of understanding or opinion. But I cannot offer that. Instead, I have implemented a level of community moderation of sorts, backed with an AI and automated on restrictive controls and banning, which both lead to permanency.

However I must stress, that this forum offers more than just a forum where you must respond to someone you consider a troll. For example, you can setup private "groups" via the messaging system where you get to choose your audience by inviting them to the conversation...

Finally, if you believe the person has other accounts - do send me a message. I did check for matching accounts but nothing came up. However, I can compare other things if you point me in that direct. Please message me, though, as I don't really enjoy taking over threads with moderation topics.

'Allowed to happen' is a very simple observation.
It did happen and it did happen, because it was not stopped in its tracks.
Therefore saying it was allowed to happen is not an unfair statement, but a fact.

You asked me names and evidence...
I told you in my DM one name.
I did not expect and did not get a response, or reaction on that message.
In my eyes it was a waste of my time even writing it.

You as the owner do have the evidence, we as posters do not have access to.

You as the owner of this platform are now reacting, due to the multitude of complaints, not because I as a single poster complained.

You must be aware that if you do not address this issue, the only way the poster can address this issue is by voting with their feet.

I do appreciate that you wish to remain impartial, however after posting on this forum since the early days and enjoying that, suddenly being told by your bot that I run the chance to get permanently banned, after an influx of some newbies, who are constantly hitting the report button and trying to change how and what we post.
I ask myself what the hell is happening here.

If people arrive on this forum and they don't like what they see, they are free to leave, there is nobody who tells them 'Please stay, we need you'.
Because at the end of the day we need idiots like that like hole in the head.

The forum was a great place until we recently were overrun by these clowns, who believe they should change the world.

As you notice, I am disappointed and pissed off.
I do not wish to be disruptive, but if this is going to be the new TSE, I have better things to do.

 

[Samus]

@Sammael who is the riddler and what is one of their riddles you mention?

, is the riddle at issue, the AVZ RCCM’s Dathcom file tweeted on April 30 2022 that you appeared to have ignored?

 

[Xerof]

AVZ can't sell to CATH while Cominiere are still in Dathcom because they would have pre-emption on the 24% (or 9%). This is also why management can't accept Zijin under any circumstances as they would then have the pre-emption on the CATH deal as their purchase would be considered to have been completed first. That's why the TIA completion keeps getting pushed back imo

Ah, yes, excellent points. Shit, even Celestine mentioned that.

 

[Dazmac66]

Thanks for responses above. No matter what happens it is a win/win for CATH.

 

[Winenut]

AVZ can't sell to CATH while Cominiere are still in Dathcom because they would have pre-emption on the 24% (or 9%). This is also why management can't accept Zijin under any circumstances as they would then have the pre-emption on the CATH deal as their purchase would be considered to have been completed first. That's why the TIA completion keeps getting pushed back imo

I get it.

So if Z are in the JV "before" any sale to CATH then as a JV member Z would have a ROFR on the sale of the 24% to CATH

Geezuz!

Which Z could then use to aquire potentially a further 24% of the project in addition to the 15% they "believe" they alreay have

No way AVZ can let that happen

So the timeline of transactions HAS to be played out carefully and in the correct order to ensure the "right" outcome

It's a serious game of chess.....hope the BoD studied Bobby Fischer

 

[Pokok]

I get it.

So if Z are in the JV "before" any sale to CATH then as a JV member Z would have a ROFR on the sale of the 24% to CATH

Geezuz!

Which Z could then use to aquire potentially a further 24% of the project in addition to the 15% they "believe" they alreay have

No way AVZ can let that happen

So the timeline of transactions HAS to be played out carefully and in the correct order to ensure the "right" outcome

It's a serious game of chess.....hope the BoD studied Bobby Fischer

serious yes , I think my tip a bit late but lets see LLL or PPK

 

[zeeb0t]

'Allowed to happen' is a very simple observation.
It did happen and it did happen, because it was not stopped in its tracks.
Therefore saying it was allowed to happen is not an unfair statement, but a fact.

You asked me names and evidence...
I told you in my DM one name.
I did not expect and did not get a response, or reaction on that message.
In my eyes it was a waste of my time even writing it.

You as the owner do have the evidence, we as posters do not have access to.

You as the owner of this platform are now reacting, due to the multitude of complaints, not because I as a single poster complained.

You must be aware that if you do not address this issue, the only way the poster can address this issue is by voting with their feet.

I do appreciate that you wish to remain impartial, however after posting on this forum since the early days and enjoying that, suddenly being told by your bot that I run the chance to get permanently banned, after an influx of some newbies, who are constantly hitting the report button and trying to change how and what we post.
I ask myself what the hell is happening here.

If people arrive on this forum and they don't like what they see, they are free to leave, there is nobody who tells them 'Please stay, we need you'.
Because at the end of the day we need idiots like that like hole in the head.

The forum was a great place until we recently were overrun by these clowns, who believe they should change the world.

As you notice, I am disappointed and pissed off.
I do not wish to be disruptive, but if this is going to be the new TSE, I have better things to do.

Mate to be fair I’ve got a 7 week old / newborn, a full time job (this is not it) and currently suffering a flu with two eyes filled with conjunctivitis over the last two weeks. It’s just a matter of playing catch up at present.

You assume a hell of a lot. You are free to come and go as you please. I won’t continue coming in here to derail the thread with this talk. Let’s chat in messages. If you say you’ve sent me a message I’ll go through and find it. As I said, I’m playing catch up presently and dealing with a few issues that have lapsed in the last few weeks.

Edit: sigh, I just checked. You mentioned one person which is already banned. You haven’t given me any more information about anyone else. If you have more information, please share it in message. Or don’t. It’s up to you.

 

[Onthefm]

AVZ can't sell to CATH while Cominiere are still in Dathcom because they would have pre-emption on the 24% (or 9%). This is also why management can't accept Zijin under any circumstances as they would then have the pre-emption on the CATH deal as their purchase would be considered to have been completed first. That's why the TIA completion keeps getting pushed back imo

I'm hoping that when all this shit is sorted all previous deals , off takes , percentage to be sold will be renegotiated with the new dfs in hand and hopefully the euros or yanks will finally stand up and be counted. As I can't see the ccp just saying oh well we lost but best of luck with your project. It's not in their dna.

 

[Roon]

AVZ can't sell to CATH while Cominiere are still in Dathcom because they would have pre-emption on the 24% (or 9%). This is also why management can't accept Zijin under any circumstances as they would then have the pre-emption on the CATH deal as their purchase would be considered to have been completed first. That's why the TIA completion keeps getting pushed back imo

Wouldn't Cominiere need to match the offer from CATH though in their preemption? They barely have enough cash for snacks

Though I guess they could get a backhand commitment from Zijin to purchase for 250m and then get a bank to back the funds.

I imagine that Cominiere agreeing in the JVA to cede 10% to government is probably one of the reasons they are fighting so hard for Zijin to take over, they must be kicking themselves at signing on to that.

 

[Mr Inappropriate]

AVZ can't sell to CATH while Cominiere are still in Dathcom because they would have pre-emption on the 24% (or 9%). This is also why management can't accept Zijin under any circumstances as they would then have the pre-emption on the CATH deal as their purchase would be considered to have been completed first. That's why the TIA completion keeps getting pushed back imo

Very good pick-up, CD.

 

[cruiser51]

Mate to be fair I’ve got a 7 week old / newborn, a full time job (this is not it) and currently suffering a flu with two eyes filled with conjunctivitis over the last two weeks. It’s just a matter of playing catch up at present.

You assume a hell of a lot. You are free to come and go as you please. I won’t continue coming in here to derail the thread with this talk. Let’s chat in messages. If you say you’ve sent me a message I’ll go through and find it. As I said, I’m playing catch up presently and dealing with a few issues that have lapsed in the last few weeks.

Edit: sigh, I just checked. You mentioned one person which is already banned. You haven’t given me any more information about anyone else. If you have more information, please share it in message. Or don’t. It’s up to you.

I can't tell you what to do, other than look after your little one and I hope you get better soon.

 

[Onthefm]

I'm hoping that when all this shit is sorted all previous deals , off takes , percentage to be sold will be renegotiated with the new dfs in hand and hopefully the euros or yanks will finally stand up and be counted. As I can't see the ccp just saying oh well we lost but best of luck with your project. It's not in their dna.

Plus hire a well connected lithium indestry jet commodity/lithium deal maker to do the deals. Steal him/ her from sqm if we have to. It's a long way down the track I know. But I prefer thinking about after shit fight than shit fight. Its healthier for me.

 

[ptlas]

Mate to be fair I’ve got a 7 week old / newborn, a full time job (this is not it) and currently suffering a flu with two eyes filled with conjunctivitis over the last two weeks. It’s just a matter of playing catch up at present.

You assume a hell of a lot. You are free to come and go as you please. I won’t continue coming in here to derail the thread with this talk. Let’s chat in messages. If you say you’ve sent me a message I’ll go through and find it. As I said, I’m playing catch up presently and dealing with a few issues that have lapsed in the last few weeks.

Edit: sigh, I just checked. You mentioned one person which is already banned. You haven’t given me any more information about anyone else. If you have more information, please share it in message. Or don’t. It’s up to you.

As much as you can, stay away from the babi. Infective conj. in newborns can be serious.
Difficult I understand.

Back to business.
The above posts are generally how I see it.
However, I don't understand what is to stop AVZ pulling the 24% once ML is issued and Com. gone and selling to Elon, BHP, Twiggy . Whoever, but at a much higher price.

If Z want it then they can then beat the new price in what effectively is an auction.

Happy if they do = more $$
(though maybe for strategic reasons it would need to go to 'The West').

Either way, I'll be gone at that point.

BTW
Dunno if I missed mention of this in a deleted post, but is nobody concerned that FT is trotting off to China like a good little boy in order to sort out previous wrongs?

If he is really serious, then surely he requires the transgressors to front up and fix it.
You dont sell anything or negotiate the sale by visiting the purchaser.
Cars, houses, land anything.

DRC owns the asset and should therefore call the shots.
Tail wagging the dog?

 

[MoneyBags1348]

"allowed to happen" is not really fair, I think. All reported posts are reviewed. The thing is, on a forum where debate is not only allowed, but encouraged, it is not always a simple thing for myself to referee a debate I know nothing at all about (I don't follow the AVZ stock). Further, the public forums are a matter of public record and it is actually illegal for me to interject on a basis of picking a 'side' as the regulations clearly imply that would likely be seen some kind of endorsement on my part. And I am not financially licensed to offer such endorsements, whether I mean to or not. Instead, I must have strict rules and require the community to vote for those who break them. I think what you expect from me is an active referee with participant level of understanding or opinion. But I cannot offer that. Instead, I have implemented a level of community moderation of sorts, backed with an AI and automated on restrictive controls and banning, which both lead to permanency.

However I must stress, that this forum offers more than just a forum where you must respond to someone you consider a troll. For example, you can setup private "groups" via the messaging system where you get to choose your audience by inviting them to the conversation...

Finally, if you believe the person has other accounts - do send me a message. I did check for matching accounts but nothing came up. However, I can compare other things if you point me in that direct. Please message me, though, as I don't really enjoy taking over threads with moderation topics.

If that is true then that's great news!!!
It has taken a longer time than many of us here have wanted and in that time we may have lost a great contributor in @MoneyBags1348 .

But it is definitely a case of better late than never and you have my gratitude and thanks for doing so before more people left.

*Edit*
The culprit has more than just one user name so hopefully they all have been dealt with.

@zeeb0t

I am aware that you are a BRN shareholder and that it was the BRN supporters who set up The Stock Exchange Forum as a result of the trolling and lack of support from moderators on the hot crapper forum. I also am a BRN shareholder and realise that you and the others have a great deal of knowledge relating to AI. As I have been so committed to supporting the success of AVZ, I have have to completely overlooked what is happening on BRN and I have had to occasionally sell some of my BRN shares just to support myself.

Like other BRN holders I have been frustrated by what has happened with the company's share price and I understand fully the disappointment of not selling at $2, however (like you) I have great faith in the company and realise that like AVZ, patience is often the only way to move forward. I don't know how BRN is travelling at the moment because as I have said, I spend all my time focusing on AVZ, but I am no small shareholder in BRN, having 200,000 shares.

I needed to relate this to you, because I believe that this may help you understand what is going on in this forum. If you read the room properly you would realise that long term AVZ holders and contributors to this forum are getting 20 or more 'likes' per post and Der Geist and John Reed are lucky to get any. This is so obvious and it is not the result of a tribal mentality as they claim, these are genuine contributors - shareholder's concerns and frustration at your lack of seeing what has happened here.

For God's sake, surely you can see what has happened and continuing to happen!! Long term contributors, dedicated to AVZ's success are being undermined and you don't seem to realise. I am not sure if this is because you are focused on BRN and trading other stocks…. But you must surely realise what happened to you and all the other BRN holders, also happened to AVZ on hot crapper, and is now happening to AVZ on TSE.

I have read your comments on our thread, and I realise it takes 5 members to report a post and have it removed, which leads me to the conclusion that there are at least 5 trolls here working together!!!!!

As you have moderated me again a week ago, and prevented me from accessing my MoneyBags1348 account as well as preventing me from posting comments for the last week, I have still managed to carry out research and speak with other shareholders outside this forum. I also received an email from Ben Cohen (AVZ Joint Secretary) which I wanted to post on the thread but couldn't.

The tone of the email from Ben (which I will add to this post) does not in any way support the cryptic comments and speculations being put forward by wombat74 and der geist some of which are below:

wombat74 posts:

My spies also informed me dathomir is out
So maybe there is some truth to some of it
Nigel and crew are back in the DRC I believe
My source is in every way unrelated to an AVZ source


Der Geist replied with:

Wombat74 a long term holder in AVZ saw it as positive as well. But nothing is set as you know.

Think about it. If it feels like inadequate context, then ask the question ask the question ask the question. But don’t flame, when you can ask. Wombat74 accepted it as valid - I think you could apologise for thinking you can be nasty, yes? You also ignored my April 30 2022 RCCM discovery, didn’t you! Yes? Whose fault is that? Context within context, means do not bitch to me about seemingly trying to be enigmatic. This journo was mentioned earlier:

I have a lot of confidence the journo knows how to analyse complexity and you would too upon knowing who. Well even shareholders here can fill in the gaps.

The journo is very experienced, is on the ground in Kinshasa. And if I did a grading ( AVZ is the most certain, and this is from someone in Kinshasa now and not connected to AVZ at all. I wish I had more to offer, perhaps soon. I may join JR’s 2023 thread with anything Material

A little more definition emerging independent journalism in Kinshasa and @Dijon101 ‘s Uber are on the similar page at this point


I notice der geist and john reed also post numerous comments for shareholders to contact both Bloomberg as well as www.aspistrategist.org.au which I'm not suggesting is suspicious, I am just drawing your attention to it

Including

@Roon this might be for you.

Submissions | The Strategist

The Strategist style guide is available here (PDF). We welcome submissions of around 800 words of original analysis, book reviews, statistics or graphs related to defence, security and strategic policy. Please email us at editors@aspi.org.au We’ll accept longer pieces on a ...

www.aspistrategist.org.au

Direct message me if interested

We should get good coverage from Bloomberg as their Journalists covering this are well connected to Global Witness and CongoHoldup teams and other links beyond my scoping. Bloomberg has not done a piece on it since May 23 2022. I’m thinking why doesn’t Tom go to Kinshasa and be a real journalist?

Why don’t you email ASPI and let them know your Chinese interference theory?


After reading der geist's post to you on the forum today, my opinion is they continue to try and influence you and AVZ shareholders with mock sincerity while they carry out an agenda and refer to the majority here as tribal and 'herd' like. I simply ask you to look at the number of impassioned responses to and by shareholders who have been long term contributors trying hard to support AVZ, and while you are at it, ask why they have stopped posting.

It's not hard to see, please consider how you would react if you were an AVZ shareholder , counting the number of responses since the two members referred to joined this forum

Fortunately I have conversations outside of this forum with @Frank @Sammael @Winenut @JAG @cruiser51 and others whose phone numbers and emails I have. I'm not here to fuck around, I've got nearly 3million shares in AVZ and I still correspond directly with the company.

I edited some of Ben's reply to me as it related to specific questions I asked him. I had plenty more to say, but to be honest mate, I think I've finally had enough of the fucken bullshit here, maybe I will PM you who I think the trolls are, but at this stage you probably wouldn't take my opinions on board and I don't think I really give a shit anymore.

MoneyBags

 

[Winenut]

Wouldn't Cominiere need to match the offer from CATH though in their preemption? They barely have enough cash for snacks

Though I guess they could get a backhand commitment from Zijin to purchase for 250m and then get a bank to back the funds.

I imagine that Cominiere agreeing in the JVA to cede 10% to government is probably one of the reasons they are fighting so hard for Zijin to take over, they must be kicking themselves at signing on to that.

It's not Cominiere that would be looking for the ROFR....they're ultimately supposed to be out of the JV in the long run

It is Zijin who would have the ROFR on any CATH deal "IF" Zijin became a JV partner with their claim to 15% prior to any % of Dathcom being offered to CATH