AVZ Discussion 2022

[Tursty]

With 35% taxes, 10% stake in Dathcom and 8% stake in $AVZ (in the event of the sale of 15% of Cominière) as well as a little over 10% in the value chain, the State holds approximately 60% of the project's net revenues over the long term. Without any investment!

Do I need to go back to school and learn Math again, or is this part the craziest bit of this whole thing. Cominiere is trying to say AVZ want it all.

How is this not a good deal for the DRC, when they have invested NOTHING, and walk away with ~45% of the profit?

 

[wombat74]

"Are we getting closer or is it another fucking mirage? "

Reckon it's just a mirage . Everything has changed but nothing has changed . Stall tactics still in play .

 

[Doc]

T

"Are we getting closer or is it another fucking mirage? "

Reckon it's just a mirage . Everything has changed but nothing has changed . Stall tactics still in play .

It’s all an illusion

 

[wombat74]

Said it once and will say it again - Strand the asset, leave it to the courts. The time for negotiation was 12 months ago.

(Sorry for all holders doing it tough, myself included)

Is that in the best interest of the SH ? I think not .

 

[Hodlandwin69]

Do I need to go back to school and learn Math again, or is this part the craziest bit of this whole thing. Cominiere is trying to say AVZ want it all.

How is this not a good deal for the DRC, when they have invested NOTHING, and walk away with ~45% of the profit?

View attachment 43241

Please correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't the SEZ have some tax free period or something? Like 2 years? I don't know specifics, please enlighten me, but perhaps they're annoyed about that as tax revenues is clearly a large chunk

 

[Hodlandwin69]

Please correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't the SEZ have some tax free period or something? Like 2 years? I don't know specifics, please enlighten me, but perhaps they're annoyed about that as tax revenues is clearly a large chunk

And different tax laws, not just standard 35% or whatever

 

[Azzler]

And different tax laws, not just standard 35% or whatever

It was a 2 year tax free period to compensate for 10% free carried.
However everything is probably renegotiated, that may or may not still stand.
Yes I didn't realise tax was 35%, seems excessive, not sure if it's right.

 

[Skar]

Is that in the best interest of the SH ? I think not .

Without having access to the facts and with clarity of hindsight, I still question how we have gone from a well-funded position and imminent ML to almost out of capital and further (decree cancelled, multiple legal challenges, etc) from an ML. Maybe management are negotiating and don't want to show their hand... but as an investor, all that capital we burnt through drilling and paying BOD for an inactive asset, has seemingly seriously weakened our position and opened me up to significant dilution.

We have to show our hand before we run out of capital (which was the Chinese strategy all along). I just hope I am wrong and NF pulls a rabbit out of a hat.... otherwise I am destined to a 9-5 for another 20 years or so.... unless there is another 25 bagger like AVZ in the mix .

 

[The Fox]

EY's Report Mid 2022

Page 371

https://assets.ey.com/content/dam/ey-sites/ey-com/en_gl/topics/tax/tax-guides/2022/ey-worldwide-corporate-tax-guide-02-aug-2022.pdf#page=379?download

PWC Report End 2022

Congo, Democratic Republic of the - Overview

Overview of business environment/doing business in the Democratic Republic of the Congo as it pertains to taxation, both individual and corporate

taxsummaries.pwc.com

 

[Tursty]

I'm betting the mining industry tax system is pretty complicated, so that was by no means meant as an indication of what tax rates to expect. It was simply quoting the figures used in the quoted post.

The point being that the benifit as a whole to the DRC by far exceeds the shareholding they retain in Dathcom. And this position some people are presenting on X that AVZ are trying to take everything for them selves is just simply wrong. The deal that is documented is actually a very fair deal for both the DRC (the owners of the lithium in the ground), and the investors that bring the capital needed to dig it out, process it and sell it.

IMO bla bla

 

[CHB]

Is that in the best interest of the SH ? I think not .

It depends on what the options are of course.

Is negotiating and having to deal with corruption and the possibility of being fucked over again down the track in the interests of shareholders?

 

[wombat74]

Without having access to the facts and with clarity of hindsight, I still question how we have gone from a well-funded position and imminent ML to almost out of capital and further (decree cancelled, multiple legal challenges, etc) from an ML. Maybe management are negotiating and don't want to show their hand... but as an investor, all that capital we burnt through drilling and paying BOD for an inactive asset, has seemingly seriously weakened our position and opened me up to significant dilution.

We have to show our hand before we run out of capital (which was the Chinese strategy all along). I just hope I am wrong and NF pulls a rabbit out of a hat.... otherwise I am destined to a 9-5 for another 20 years or so.... unless there is another 25 bagger like AVZ in the mix .

Can you imagine the BoD taking salary over the next 3 to 5 years while we fight it out in the courts? For what ?

 

[wombat74]

It depends on what the options are of course.

Is negotiating and having to deal with corruption and the possibility of being fucked over again down the track in the interests of shareholders?

True . However some may just like access to their money and the ability to decide what they want to do . The damage is done in terms of trust regardless how this plays out . If we are still at a Brick Wall then a negotiated settlement , whether by pay out or collaborative agreement , is the right way forward imo . I don't know anyone who wants their money tied up in this sh1t show for years to come .

 

[wombat74]

Cybelle Kamba Kabasu
@CybelleKamba

"Before withdrawing the complaint(legal process) make sure you get what is rightfully yours and if not, go all the way but what is true, the DRC has no money to pay the damages".

 

[tonster66]

The President is outraged by the lack of action! WTF

 

[The Fox]

The President is outraged by the lack of action! WTF

So he puts the foxes in charge of the hen house to sort it all out and to report back to him. FFS !!!

 

[TheCount]

The President is outraged by the lack of action! WTF

 

[Xerof]

The President is outraged by the lack of action! WTF

So, he has yet another pocket of corruption to sort out - the judicial system. I think work on that is underway, but yes, Jules is toothless without anyone taking his findings a step further and prosecuting (in front of non-corrupt magistrates/judges)

I don't know who the intermediary is to pick up his findings and act on them, but it should be something like a Serious Fraud Office, or alternatively give Jules and his team the power to do it themselves

what a fucking shitshow

 

[BRICK]

back into the cupboard then...

 

[Carlos Danger]

And different tax laws, not just standard 35% or whatever

It was a 2 year tax free period to compensate for 10% free carried.
However everything is probably renegotiated, that may or may not still stand.
Yes I didn't realise tax was 35%, seems excessive, not sure if it's right.

I'm betting the mining industry tax system is pretty complicated, so that was by no means meant as an indication of what tax rates to expect. It was simply quoting the figures used in the quoted post.

The point being that the benifit as a whole to the DRC by far exceeds the shareholding they retain in Dathcom. And this position some people are presenting on X that AVZ are trying to take everything for them selves is just simply wrong. The deal that is documented is actually a very fair deal for both the DRC (the owners of the lithium in the ground), and the investors that bring the capital needed to dig it out, process it and sell it.

IMO bla bla

35% is correct when inclusive of 5% export tax which all of our curent offtakes will be subject to. Tax rate is 30% on profits made within the DRC.