AVZ Discussion 2022

[Rechnerhand]

Anyone can see what is behind teased number of '$3tn' in this article?

Washington deal: intricacies behind Tshisekedi's poker move

 

[Dave Evans]

So will AVZ announce the ICSID is postponed ? Or do we figure that out for ourselves ?

Here’s the link and case number Wombles, it only takes a few seconds to get to the their latest update, just click on the blue link below and put the case number in

ICSID (Title Dispute)
Case No. ARB/23/20

ICSID (World Bank) Link

Case Details | ICSID​

@j.l you can see by the latest article about KoBold, they are still going on about AVZ being in dispute, and then they like to add, KoBold’s offer proposes to resolve the dispute by providing AVZ “appropriate compensation”

Basically always using the same words. We don’t know what they think appropriate compensation is, we only know they were offering up to $US1.5bn ($2.38bn) plus a royalty.

They just keep adding in the same comments: disputed license, no assurance of any outcome, they’re doing us a favour etc. I still think they’ll try and pay fuck all and then charge an arm and a leg to the highest bidder to form a JV with them once they’ve got the license. Imagine how much money the Saudi’s, Rio or another major would pay them for a 50% share in the project

 

[PhatCatz]

Here’s the link and case number Wombles, it only takes a few seconds to get to the their latest update, just click on the blue link below and put the case number in

ICSID (Title Dispute)
Case No. ARB/23/20

ICSID (World Bank) Link

Case Details | ICSID​

@j.l you can see by the latest article about KoBold, they are still going on about AVZ being in dispute, and then they like to add, KoBold’s offer proposes to resolve the dispute by providing AVZ “appropriate compensation”

Basically always using the same words. We don’t know what they think appropriate compensation is, we only know they were offering up to $US1.5bn ($2.38bn) plus a royalty.

They just keep adding in the same comments: disputed license, no assurance of any outcome, they’re doing us a favour etc. I still think they’ll try and pay fuck all and then charge an arm and a leg to the highest bidder to form a JV with them once they’ve got the license. Imagine how much money the Saudi’s, Rio or another major would pay them for a 50% share in the project

that’s the play by them. Nail hitting the head there mate.

They’ve given us a second wind alongside the US no doubt but they will play games to get what they need for as little as they can.

 

[Dave Evans]

Agree with a lot of what you are saying. Maybe we can put differences behind us.

US $1.5b IF that article was correct. I believe they have come up a fair way since then.

Fuck off idiot (@j19 that is for those who have him on ignore) Same goes for your lying histrionic mate @Yaseen

 

[Dave Evans]

You want play it like this after I offered to let it go? Ok

Are the lads on the forum aware of your history of domestic violence with Nicole?

Does it make you feel like a big man to assault a woman? I suppose women are the only people you can pull that with. If you did it to a bloke you'd get your head kicked in, because you are a little small tiny man.

You want to play it like this I can make you face real world consequences.

Every one here knows your a troll and a liar, and a mate of shane the goose, like I said fuck off idiot

 

[CashKing]

You want play it like this after I offered to let it go? Ok

Are the lads on the forum aware of your history of domestic violence with Nicole?

Does it make you feel like a big man to assault a woman? I suppose women are the only people you can pull that with. If you did it to a bloke you'd get your head kicked in, because you are a little small tiny man.

You want to play it like this I can make you face real world consequences.

Fuck I just want my money back and some…

Clearly you know each other & the cuckolding Didn’t go well but Fuxk WTF

 

[Dave Evans]

love you too Davo, dont start, just pull ya head in cocksucker , leave me out of it

You and j19 going tandem again. And please j19 enlighten everyone on Nicole, I’m sure it’s very interesting, signing out now, I’ll leave you two clowns with your gimp fetish to bore each other. Oh before I go, fuck off idiotic.

 

[Samus]

Fuck off idiot (@j19 that is for those who have him on ignore) Same goes for your lying histrionic mate @Yaseen

I had to block that same fuckwit on twitter too Dave. I'm glad I can no longer see whatever they're saying. Ignore is highly recommended.

 

[Hudnut]

Just in case we all forget what this forum is about.
Christ on a bike.

 

[TheGermanOne]

Lithium de Manono: entre attentes et désespoir

La République Démocratique du Congo possède l'un des plus grands gisements de lithium dans le monde. Le lithium, c’est un minerai très recherché aujourd’hui car il sert à faire des piles rechargeables pour les appareils électroniques.

actualite.cd

Can anyone translate the 20 min long podcast in this link about the manono case from french to english? Thx

 

[lellep]

Lithium de Manono: entre attentes et désespoir

La République Démocratique du Congo possède l'un des plus grands gisements de lithium dans le monde. Le lithium, c’est un minerai très recherché aujourd’hui car il sert à faire des piles rechargeables pour les appareils électroniques.

actualite.cd

Can anyone translate the 20 min long podcast in this link about the manono case from french to english? Thx

Translation and summary by GROK ( X AI)


The article from Actualité.cd, titled "Lithium de Manono: entre attentes et désespoir," discusses the significant lithium deposit in Manono, located in Tanganyika province, Democratic Republic of Congo (DRC), which is one of the largest in the world. Despite its potential to drive economic development due to the global demand for lithium in rechargeable batteries for electric vehicles and other technologies, the project has faced numerous delays and challenges, leading to both hope and frustration among locals and stakeholders.
Key points from the article and related sources:

1. Economic Potential and Delays: The Manono lithium deposit, estimated at 842 million tonnes with a 1.61% lithium grade, is a critical asset for the DRC, especially given the global push for energy transition. However, exploitation has not yet started due to administrative blockages, legal disputes, and shifts in partnerships, leaving local communities waiting for promised economic benefits like jobs and infrastructure development.
2. Historical Context: Manono was historically a hub for tin mining under the Belgian colonial era and later through the state-owned Zaïrétain (now Cominière). The decline of tin mining, exacerbated by wars and mismanagement, left the region economically stagnant. The discovery of lithium by AVZ Minerals in 2016 sparked hopes of economic revival, but progress has been slow.
3. Corporate and Legal Disputes: Initially, AVZ Minerals, an Australian company, led the project through a joint venture with Cominière. However, conflicts arose, including accusations of AVZ hiding exploration data and mismanagement by Cominière. The DRC government shifted focus to a Chinese company, Zijin Mining, granting them a research permit in 2023, sidelining AVZ, which then pursued arbitration at the International Chamber of Commerce.

• In May 2025, KoBold Metals announced a framework agreement to acquire AVZ Minerals' interests in the Manono lithium deposit, signaling a potential exit for AVZ from the project. This follows years of legal and administrative challenges for AVZ, including disputes with the Congolese state-owned company Cominière and the Congolese government's decision to favor Zijin Mining, a Chinese company, with a research permit in 2023.
• The article highlights ongoing arbitration at the International Chamber of Commerce, where AVZ is challenging decisions that sidelined it from the project. A recent ruling ordered Cominière to pay AVZ €39.1 million ($42.6 million) for breaching emergency orders, but this payment does not resolve the broader dispute over the mining permit, which remains uncertain.
• Despite the potential for economic transformation in Manono through lithium mining, local communities remain frustrated due to delays, lack of tangible benefits like jobs or infrastructure, and environmental concerns, with no clear timeline for when exploitation might begin.

1. Impact on AVZ Minerals:
   • Potential Exit from Manono: The agreement with KoBold Metals suggests AVZ may be selling or transferring its stake in the Manono project, likely due to prolonged legal battles and loss of its mining permit to Zijin Mining. This could mark the end of AVZ’s direct involvement in what was once touted as a world-class lithium project.
   • Financial Compensation: The €39.1 million arbitration award provides AVZ with some financial relief, but it does not restore its operational control or permit rights, limiting its ability to capitalize on the project’s potential.
   • Reputation and Future Prospects: AVZ’s experience in Manono, marked by accusations of withholding exploration data and conflicts with Cominière, may damage its reputation in the DRC and other mining jurisdictions. The shift to KoBold Metals, a well-funded U.S. competitor, could further marginalize AVZ in the global lithium market.
   • Local Impact: The article notes that AVZ’s tenure did not deliver promised economic benefits to Manono, and its potential exit may further delay local development unless KoBold accelerates progress. However, AVZ’s departure could also open the door for a more stable partnership under KoBold, potentially benefiting the region in the long term.
2. The article underscores a mix of hope and despair in Manono, with AVZ’s likely withdrawal representing a significant setback for the company but a potential new chapter for the project under KoBold Metals. For the most current updates, checking posts on X or financial news about AVZ and KoBold could provide further clarity, as the situation remains fluid.

 

[Spikerama]

Now we've hit Ten, it's not if ... It's when.

 

[Winenut]

Translation and summary by GROK ( X AI)


The article from Actualité.cd, titled "Lithium de Manono: entre attentes et désespoir," discusses the significant lithium deposit in Manono, located in Tanganyika province, Democratic Republic of Congo (DRC), which is one of the largest in the world. Despite its potential to drive economic development due to the global demand for lithium in rechargeable batteries for electric vehicles and other technologies, the project has faced numerous delays and challenges, leading to both hope and frustration among locals and stakeholders.
Key points from the article and related sources:

1. Economic Potential and Delays: The Manono lithium deposit, estimated at 842 million tonnes with a 1.61% lithium grade, is a critical asset for the DRC, especially given the global push for energy transition. However, exploitation has not yet started due to administrative blockages, legal disputes, and shifts in partnerships, leaving local communities waiting for promised economic benefits like jobs and infrastructure development.
2. Historical Context: Manono was historically a hub for tin mining under the Belgian colonial era and later through the state-owned Zaïrétain (now Cominière). The decline of tin mining, exacerbated by wars and mismanagement, left the region economically stagnant. The discovery of lithium by AVZ Minerals in 2016 sparked hopes of economic revival, but progress has been slow.
3. Corporate and Legal Disputes: Initially, AVZ Minerals, an Australian company, led the project through a joint venture with Cominière. However, conflicts arose, including accusations of AVZ hiding exploration data and mismanagement by Cominière. The DRC government shifted focus to a Chinese company, Zijin Mining, granting them a research permit in 2023, sidelining AVZ, which then pursued arbitration at the International Chamber of Commerce.

• In May 2025, KoBold Metals announced a framework agreement to acquire AVZ Minerals' interests in the Manono lithium deposit, signaling a potential exit for AVZ from the project. This follows years of legal and administrative challenges for AVZ, including disputes with the Congolese state-owned company Cominière and the Congolese government's decision to favor Zijin Mining, a Chinese company, with a research permit in 2023.
• The article highlights ongoing arbitration at the International Chamber of Commerce, where AVZ is challenging decisions that sidelined it from the project. A recent ruling ordered Cominière to pay AVZ €39.1 million ($42.6 million) for breaching emergency orders, but this payment does not resolve the broader dispute over the mining permit, which remains uncertain.
• Despite the potential for economic transformation in Manono through lithium mining, local communities remain frustrated due to delays, lack of tangible benefits like jobs or infrastructure, and environmental concerns, with no clear timeline for when exploitation might begin.

1. Impact on AVZ Minerals:
   • Potential Exit from Manono: The agreement with KoBold Metals suggests AVZ may be selling or transferring its stake in the Manono project, likely due to prolonged legal battles and loss of its mining permit to Zijin Mining. This could mark the end of AVZ’s direct involvement in what was once touted as a world-class lithium project.
   • Financial Compensation: The €39.1 million arbitration award provides AVZ with some financial relief, but it does not restore its operational control or permit rights, limiting its ability to capitalize on the project’s potential.
   • Reputation and Future Prospects: AVZ’s experience in Manono, marked by accusations of withholding exploration data and conflicts with Cominière, may damage its reputation in the DRC and other mining jurisdictions. The shift to KoBold Metals, a well-funded U.S. competitor, could further marginalize AVZ in the global lithium market.
   • Local Impact: The article notes that AVZ’s tenure did not deliver promised economic benefits to Manono, and its potential exit may further delay local development unless KoBold accelerates progress. However, AVZ’s departure could also open the door for a more stable partnership under KoBold, potentially benefiting the region in the long term.
2. The article underscores a mix of hope and despair in Manono, with AVZ’s likely withdrawal representing a significant setback for the company but a potential new chapter for the project under KoBold Metals. For the most current updates, checking posts on X or financial news about AVZ and KoBold could provide further clarity, as the situation remains fluid.

Thanks for translating but certainly not my favourite read overall

 

[TheCount]

Now we've hit Ten, it's not if... It's when.

View attachment 84995

 

[Skar]

Thanks for translating but certainly not my favourite read overall

Its expected for Kobold to try to get the best deal possible. Likewise its expected for Nige and Team to get the best deal possible for us... what I don't like is the lie that we need to rush a sale, accept whatever we can get, its our only pathway forward or we are desperate to sell, etc. Thats all pure fabricated tree shaking nonsense, we were in a very bad position until Cath fronted us. Vocal individual holders might want an out now but the company is fine to progress through legal issues and into fundraising and into production (the cases should be used to leverage a settlement or get compensation awarded, to again lead to a settlement like awarding ML etc).

If the deal on offer isn't right, I just hope Nige has enough backing form the top shareholders to walk out on it. Change is happening in Africa, and globally electrification is not going away (its accelerating now too). Now is the best time for buyers but in 1-3 years it will be a sellers market.

That said if a fair value offer is available, I am happy to sail away. I am not as optimistic as some but low number billions is an insult.

 

[ptlas]

This should get sent straight to Davy boy every time he runs his fat traumatised emotional trap trying to derail the forum. J19 literally just offered a truce to him, and not only did he tell him to fuck off he then dragged me into it out of nowhere. Fuck him, he needs to be pulled into line. Someone might need to ring ASIO, he's terrorising the forum

I take it that you've studied the methods of Henry Kissinger?

 

[ptlas]

Its expected for Kobold to try to get the best deal possible. Likewise its expected for Nige and Team to get the best deal possible for us... what I don't like is the lie that we need to rush a sale, accept whatever we can get, its our only pathway forward or we are desperate to sell, etc. Thats all pure fabricated tree shaking nonsense, we were in a very bad position until Cath fronted us. Vocal individual holders might want an out now but the company is fine to progress through legal issues and into fundraising and into production (the cases should be used to leverage a settlement or get compensation awarded, to again lead to a settlement like awarding ML etc).

If the deal on offer isn't right, I just hope Nige has enough backing form the top shareholders to walk out on it. Change is happening in Africa, and globally electrification is not going away (its accelerating now too). Now is the best time for buyers but in 1-3 years it will be a sellers market.

That said if a fair value offer is available, I am happy to sail away. I am not as optimistic as some but low number billions is an insult.

KoBold continually talking down price, while not actually talking it down, indicates that they are some way apart from AVZ on valuation.

Nige has ICSID and the funds to see it through, while he appears not to be pressured by SH into a poor deal.

He also has any number of counter offers/proposals, though we would do well to remember that their may not be any.

Battery storage is finally starting to ramp up, not least in China where they are now installing ridiculous amounts of solar.

The clock is ticking regarding M23 and ICSID for our DRC ' partners '.

NF has not blinked yet, I dont see him doing so now.

 

[wombat74]

Here’s the link and case number Wombles, it only takes a few seconds to get to the their latest update, just click on the blue link below and put the case number in

ICSID (Title Dispute)
Case No. ARB/23/20

ICSID (World Bank) Link

Case Details | ICSID​

@j.l you can see by the latest article about KoBold, they are still going on about AVZ being in dispute, and then they like to add, KoBold’s offer proposes to resolve the dispute by providing AVZ “appropriate compensation”

Basically always using the same words. We don’t know what they think appropriate compensation is, we only know they were offering up to $US1.5bn ($2.38bn) plus a royalty.

They just keep adding in the same comments: disputed license, no assurance of any outcome, they’re doing us a favour etc. I still think they’ll try and pay fuck all and then charge an arm and a leg to the highest bidder to form a JV with them once they’ve got the license. Imagine how much money the Saudi’s, Rio or another major would pay them for a 50% share in the project

Mate I don't think we have been seeing updated info re AVZ deal $$$,but regurgitations from the original media release . Maybe some new info re Kobold rallying their work force inside the DRC . Talking up their ambitions . My feel is a deal will be struck(if not already) and ICSID aborted . Hopefully the DRC gov/ Chinese don't f--k it up .

 

[LOCKY82]

Mate I don't think we have been seeing updated info re AVZ deal $$$,but regurgitations from the original media release . Maybe some new info re Kobold rallying their work force inside the DRC . Talking up their ambitions . My feel is a deal will be struck(if not already) and ICSID aborted . Hopefully the DRC gov/ Chinese don't f--k it up .

Thats my biggest fear that they manage to find a way to fuck this up, I reckon/hope it's too far gone now for anyone to stop, imo

 

[Spikerama]

AVZ vs DRC @ ICSID - Final Countdown

Countdown to the ICSID tribunal of AVZ vs DRC (Congolese).

avz-icsid-final-countdown.netlify.app