AVZ Discussion 2022

[Xerof]

I posted this on hotcrapper, let me know your thoughts:

"Good post Xerof, however if a deal is struck with the DRC govt in obtaining a ML and therefore all court cases are dropped at part of the deal, I would suspect that the Dathomir percentage would go to CATH given they will ultimately be the ones whom will negotiate with Simon Cong.

Sure if we continued down the ICC / ISCID route then yes AVZ would claim the % from Dathomir due to a legal win awarding us the rights, however I don't believe this will be case moving forward. My feel is all negotiations will be done by CATH! AVZ will take a backseat in all dealings!

As we all know AVZ doesn't have a great name in the DRC (not our fault) and therefore my feel is for us to secure ML, drop cases, provide what is seen as a win-win for the DRC govt we will become a minority holder. The transaction/payout/transfer on Dathomir will tip us into the minority holder status. I do believe however we will have higher voting rights, as this would have been written up legally. The reason I say this is because CATH will not be able to override/spill the board with votes as part of the relationship deed. We need to read between the lines here."

To be honest I don't know why anyone thinks Cong has a valid case. He's fucking toast. (I do recall a person who shall remain nameless saying a couple of years ago that Pei will take care of Cong from the sidelines) I'm not going down that rabbit hole but I suspect things have moved on from such hubris and the courts will decide, or Xi


And all these negative slants just fire up the shitstain with his incomprehensible rubbish

Found something in the 2022 Accounts

So getting somehwere at least

View attachment 75819

EDIT: Thanks Carlos for your post above. I didn't see it before posting mine

Wino, I would assume most or all those other 'service' entities will end up under GLH (mentioned in the announcement)

 

[Carlos Danger]

Thanks Carlos

The other pieces of the puzzle is the underlying detail

We know AVZ is not "directly" involved with Dathcom (it's simplified in the pie charts showing just "AVZ")

The actual party involved with Dathcom is AVZI

AVZ International Pty Ltd (AVZI) is a subsidiary of AVZ Minerals and has it's own shareholding structure

So too does the related entity Green Lithium Holdings Pte Ltd (GLH)

It's all of these underlying parent and subsidiary relationships/ corporate structures and % shareholders/shareholdings that I'm really after

Also interested in certainty on where they are domiciled

We know AVZ is in Australia, AVZI I'm note sure, GLH I think Singapore or Hong Kong

https://static1.squarespace.com/static/5934d2ae6b8f5beeb5ba23f3/t/65372fdc9e3b7640543a274d/1698115576754/20231024+ASX+Annual+Report.pdf

View attachment 75815

Found something in the 2022 Accounts

So getting somehwere at least

View attachment 75819

EDIT: Thanks Carlos for your post above. I didn't see it before posting mine

https://static1.squarespace.com/static/5934d2ae6b8f5beeb5ba23f3/t/65577f9e3ceec52a0ea0145a/1700233132219/Affaire+CCI+27720+SP+%28EA%29-Ordonnance+CS+15-11-23+-+Eng+Translation.pdf

There are a few interesting few points in the ICC emergency orders for the Cominiere case

All of the decisions especially around costs refer to GLH as the primary claimant

So at some point the control of 75% holding in Dathcom has somehow been transferred from AVZI to GLH after incorporation in Singapore on 8 March 2022 imo

Note 13 on page 30 says ‘The emergency arbitrator notes in this regard that although the Respondent indicates in its Response that GLH is not a shareholder of the company and that the transfer of AVZ shares to the latter was not ratified by the company (see paragraph 24), the Defendant draws no conclusions from this’

There is a pertinent question of exactly how GLH has ownership and whether Cominiere should have had FROR over any ‘transfer’. I’m guessing they just sold / transferred AVZI to GLH to avoid this issue and firb for the restructured CATH TIA but I don’t know for sure.

 

[Pokok]

Impressionist? Surrealist? Water Colour? Realist? Expressionist? Landscape? Portrait? Dulux????

Just stirring

Wattle

 

[Winenut]

Anyone care to just run a ruler over this and see that I've got the starting point correct?

Note this structure is "pre" the awarding of a Mining Licence, does not take into account the dispute with Dathomir and does not incorporate any other events like the fucksticks Cominiere illegally floging off 15% to corrupt Zijin, the previous TIA with CATH picking up 24% nor the new proposed arrangement with CATH/Mr Pei involving GLH

 

[Carlos Danger]

View attachment 75828

Anyone care to just run a ruler over this and see that I've got the starting point correct?

Note this structure is "pre" the awarding of a Mining Licence, does not take into account the dispute with Dathomir and does not incorporate any other events like the fucksticks Cominiere illegally floging off 15% to corrupt Zijin, the previous TIA with CATH picking up 24% nor the new proposed arrangement with CATH/Mr Pei involving GLH

GLH has to sit between AVZ and AVZI or they wouldn't be a party to all of the various arbitrations imo

And there's a U missing from Cominiere's abbreviation

 

[Winenut]

Thank you for that @Carlos Danger

Does your comment on the positions imply that AVZI is a 100% subsidiary of GLH who is in turn a 100% subsidiary of AVZ Minerals?

 

[Winenut]

GLH has to sit between AVZ and AVZI or they wouldn't be a party to all of the various arbitrations imo

And there's a U missing from Cominiere's abbreviation

I didn't want to be too obvious with the ticker for Cominiere but I'm glad you picked up where I was going

 

[Carlos Danger]

Thank you for that @Carlos Danger

Does your comment on the positions imply that AVZI is a 100% subsidiary of GLH who is in turn a 100% subsidiary of AVZ Minerals?

Yeah I reckon

Could be that they made GLH a subsidary of AVZI instead but that would require a transfer of the Datchom shares to GLH which would have most likely caused FROR problems under the Dathcom JVA

Either way GLH needs to be between AVZ and AVZI or AVZI and Dathcom for GLH to be a party to arbitrations and for sale of its shares to represent an indirect 30.5% interest in Manono transferred to CATH imo

 

[Winenut]

Yeah I reckon

Could be that they made GLH a subsidary of AVZI instead but that would require a transfer of the Datchom shares to GLH which would have most likely caused FROR problems under the Dathcom JVA

Either way GLH needs to be between AVZ and AVZI or AVZI and Dathcom for GLH to be a party to arbitrations and for sale of its shares to represent an indirect 30.5% interest in Manono transferred to CATH imo

Cool

I'll redo my structure and then start having a look at the proposed arrangement and possible scenarios and see how it all flows through

Fuck I'm a nerd.....

 

[Winenut]

Oh.....and thanks for your help Carlos

Much appreciated

 

[BEISHA]

I posted this on hotcrapper, let me know your thoughts:

"Good post Xerof, however if a deal is struck with the DRC govt in obtaining a ML and therefore all court cases are dropped at part of the deal, I would suspect that the Dathomir percentage would go to CATH given they will ultimately be the ones whom will negotiate with Simon Cong.

Sure if we continued down the ICC / ISCID route then yes AVZ would claim the % from Dathomir due to a legal win awarding us the rights, however I don't believe this will be case moving forward. My feel is all negotiations will be done by CATH! AVZ will take a backseat in all dealings!

As we all know AVZ doesn't have a great name in the DRC (not our fault) and therefore my feel is for us to secure ML, drop cases, provide what is seen as a win-win for the DRC govt we will become a minority holder. The transaction/payout/transfer on Dathomir will tip us into the minority holder status. I do believe however we will have higher voting rights, as this would have been written up legally. The reason I say this is because CATH will not be able to override/spill the board with votes as part of the relationship deed. We need to read between the lines here."

Wow, thats a mind blowing commission if i ever heard one !

I prefer it if Felix the fat cat negotiated with Cong along these lines....

"Cong you corrupt cunt, time to give the game away, you have no chance of winning the arbitration case and i want my battery hub so i can show the locals that i am doing something for them with the hope of getting re elected.'

"If you dont reliquish the 15% back to AVZ, you might force my hand and i get the rebels to blow up your hotels or make you disappear....

 

[Winenut]

Logically now putting all the pieces together and considering FIRB issues and the JV requirements I reckon this is the most likely starting point

GLH couldn't have been transferred the Dathcom holding/interest from AVZI (FIRB probably wouldn't allow it and the rules of the JV might have been triggered in some way)

 

[Miljew91]

View attachment 75829

Anyone care to just run a ruler over this and see that I've got the starting point correct?

Note this structure is "pre" the awarding of a Mining Licence, does not take into account the dispute with Dathomir and does not incorporate any other events like the fucksticks Cominiere illegally floging off 15% to corrupt Zijin, the previous TIA with CATH picking up 24% nor the new proposed arrangement with CATH/Mr Pei involving GLH

CNTS 25% HAHAHAHAHAHA

 

[Carlos Danger]

Cool

I'll redo my structure and then start having a look at the proposed arrangement and possible scenarios and see how it all flows through

Fuck I'm a nerd.....

Just to add to the confusion...

The 2023 annual report says:

AVZ International Pty Ltd (AVZI) which is the wholly owned subsidiary of AVZ that holds 75% of the shares in Dathcom pursuant to the Dathcom joint venture agreement dated 27 January 2017, as amended from time to time (Dathcom JVA)

The December 2023 Quartely says:

AVZ International Pty Ltd (AVZI) and Green Lithium Holdings Pte Ltd (GLH) which are wholly owned subsidiaries of AVZ that held or currently hold 75% of the shares in Dathcom pursuant to the Dathcom joint venture agreement dated 27 January 2017, as amended from time to time (Dathcom JVA)

Each of them could be interpreted as saying structure is AVZ - GLH - AVZI - Dathcom or AVZ - AVZI - GLH - Dathcom haha

The other issue I have with AVZ - AVZI - GLH - Dathcom is there would be no need for AVZI to be involved in the arbitrations as the shares would have been transferred to GLH but AVZI are still listed as a party in every case

Therefore AVZ - GLH - AVZI - Dathcom makes the most logical sense imo

 

[BEISHA]

Re: Mt feel is all negotiations will be done by CATH! AVZ will take a backseat in all dealings!

I can't see the majority holder (AVZ/GLH) allowing the Chinese minority holder (CATH) to negotiate on it's behalf. From a business strategy point of view, that's corporate suicide.

AVZ hasn't fought tooth and nail for the past two years against a relentless campaign of graft and corruption to simply relinquish its negotiating position and its future to the Chinese.

Agree, i am pretty sure the relationship with AVZ / CATH has been strained in the past, as other posters have mentioned Cath can be a bit of a turn coat ........they voted for MAGA 2 yrs ago plus i am sure prior to that i remember somewhere Pei was meant to catch up with Nigel for a important meeting, yet cancelled and conducted a private meeting with Cong instead.

Once bitten twice shy needs to be the approach.

 

[BEISHA]

Just to add to the confusion...

The 2023 annual report says:

AVZ International Pty Ltd (AVZI) which is the wholly owned subsidiary of AVZ that holds 75% of the shares in Dathcom pursuant to the Dathcom joint venture agreement dated 27 January 2017, as amended from time to time (Dathcom JVA)

The December 2023 Quartely says:

AVZ International Pty Ltd (AVZI) and Green Lithium Holdings Pte Ltd (GLH) which are wholly owned subsidiaries of AVZ that held or currently hold 75% of the shares in Dathcom pursuant to the Dathcom joint venture agreement dated 27 January 2017, as amended from time to time (Dathcom JVA)

Each could be interpreted as saying structure is AVZ - GLH - AVZI - Dathcom or AVZ - AVZI - GLH - Dathcom haha

The other issue I have with AVZ - AVZI - GLH - Dathcom is there would be no need for AVZI to be involved in the arbitrations as the shares would have been transferred to GLH but AVZI are still listed as a party in every case

Therefore AVZ - GLH - AVZI - Dathcom makes the most logical sense imo

 

[BEISHA]

View attachment 75829

Anyone care to just run a ruler over this and see that I've got the starting point correct?

Note this structure is "pre" the awarding of a Mining Licence, does not take into account the dispute with Dathomir and does not incorporate any other events like the fucksticks Cominiere illegally floging off 15% to corrupt Zijin, the previous TIA with CATH picking up 24% nor the new proposed arrangement with CATH/Mr Pei involving GLH

What does CNTS under Cominiere refer to ?

I am asking for a friend....

 

[Winenut]

Just to add to the confusion...

The 2023 annual report says:

AVZ International Pty Ltd (AVZI) which is the wholly owned subsidiary of AVZ that holds 75% of the shares in Dathcom pursuant to the Dathcom joint venture agreement dated 27 January 2017, as amended from time to time (Dathcom JVA)

The December 2023 Quartely says:

AVZ International Pty Ltd (AVZI) and Green Lithium Holdings Pte Ltd (GLH) which are wholly owned subsidiaries of AVZ that held or currently hold 75% of the shares in Dathcom pursuant to the Dathcom joint venture agreement dated 27 January 2017, as amended from time to time (Dathcom JVA)

Each of them could be interpreted as saying structure is AVZ - GLH - AVZI - Dathcom or AVZ - AVZI - GLH - Dathcom haha

The other issue I have with AVZ - AVZI - GLH - Dathcom is there would be no need for AVZI to be involved in the arbitrations as the shares would have been transferred to GLH but AVZI are still listed as a party in every case

Therefore AVZ - GLH - AVZI - Dathcom makes the most logical sense imo

"Therefore AVZ - GLH - AVZI - Dathcom makes the most logical sense imo"

 

[Winenut]

What does CNTS under Cominiere refer to ?

I am asking for a friend....

It refers to CUNTS

Let your friend know

 

[cruiser51]

Yeah I reckon

Could be that they made GLH a subsidary of AVZI instead but that would require a transfer of the Datchom shares to GLH which would have most likely caused FROR problems under the Dathcom JVA

Either way GLH needs to be between AVZ and AVZI or AVZI and Dathcom for GLH to be a party to arbitrations and for sale of its shares to represent an indirect 30.5% interest in Manono transferred to CATH imo

CATH will pay AVZ US$259.25m to acquire a 30.5% indirect interest in the Manono Project, through the acquisition of shares in Green Lithium Holding Lte. Ltd (GLH) (a wholly owned subsidiary of AVZ International Pty Ltd (AVZI) and the holder of legal title to AVZ's interest in Dathcom Mining SA (Dathcom)),

So it is AVZ - AVZI - GLH - Dathcom

IMO