THE VOICE - WHAT IS THE REAL TRUTH BEHIND IT ? / GENERAL POLITICAL THREAD

[BEISHA]

Hi All

As a proud australian who believes that we live in the lucky country and everyone is equal regardless of colour / religion / ethnicity, i was rather shocked to watch a report from Sky News / Peta Credlin, regards to the FULL ULURU STATEMENT which has been begrudgingly released by the Labour Govt under the FREEDOM OF INFORMATION ACT just a couple of days ago.

I believe if the VOICE is all about the ULURU STATEMENT, and the YES campaign succeeds in the upcoming referendum and engrained in the constitution, then i believe Australia will go backwards big time, create a big divide, create immense anger and potentially, racism will elevate to a new level.

Now, before anyone comes back to me that i am on the NO campaign band wagon, pushing an agenda, far from it, my only purpose for initiating this thread is to implore that everyone get fully informed before casting a vote on the VOICE, cause once its legislated, there is no turning back..........

Please read / watch the below article in its entirety, then read the 26 page FULL ULURU STATEMENT, which Albanese stated publicly many times "fitted on a A4 sheet of paper and would only take 2 minutes to read ".....

Peta Credlin exposes Uluru Statement from the Heart’s 'true agenda'

Peta Credlin has revealed all 26 pages of the Uluru Statement from the Heart under the Freedom of Information Act, contradicting claims made by Anthony Albanese that the declaration is no more than a two minute read.

www.skynews.com.au

I open this topic up for mature respectful debate, happy to also debate other political topics too...

 

[TDITD]

Yes I have seen this and will attach the full statement below as a PDF.

Now it's with anything in life you need to research and educate yourself on whats what before you can have an opinion on what's what. A simple but, oh so true fact that was once common sense.

Unfortunately far far too many people just watch t.v (news, drum, project) and think they know what's happening, when did we become so silly. Would you buy a car because the T.V ad on a Volkswagen was really good and told you that you needed it ?

Exactly ridiculous. If you were looking to buy a car you would research yes of course to avoid overpaying, to make sure the model doesn't have problems and a myriad of other reasons that would enable you to make a confident and informed decision.

The 'yes' vote is far more important than a car. It flabbergasts me that people (cretins) don't do ANY research, the same crowd with covid really, the same crowd with CBDCs.

Please do watch the video, please also read the whole uluru statement. Then make your own minds up. It's disturbing a FOI request was needed for the truth to come out, tells you alot about this whole fiasco, the statement itself, Peta covers it well, its disgusting. An obvious trojan horse imo.

 

[BEISHA]

Yes I have seen this and will attach the full statement below as a PDF.

Now it's with anything in life you need to research and educate yourself on whats what before you can have an opinion on what's what. A simple but, oh so true fact that was once common sense.

Unfortunately far far too many people just watch t.v (news, drum, project) and think they know what's happening, when did we become so silly. Would you buy a car because the T.V ad on a Volkswagen was really good and told you that you needed it ?

Exactly ridiculous. If you were looking to buy a car you would research yes of course to avoid overpaying, to make sure the model doesn't have problems and a myriad of other reasons that would enable you to make a confident and informed decision.

The 'yes' vote is far more important than a car. It flabbergasts me that people (cretins) don't do ANY research, the same crowd with covid really, the same crowd with CBDCs.

Please do watch the video, please also read the whole uluru statement. Then make your own minds up. It's disturbing a FOI request was needed for the truth to come out, tells you alot about this whole fiasco, the statement itself, Peta covers it well, its disgusting. An obvious trojan horse imo.

"An obvious trojan horse imo."

Couldnt agree more, the thing that really disappoints me with the Uluru statement is that the tone of the statement is very much looking at the past still, some 240 yrs back , i mean when are we going to move forward and look to the future as a united australia ?

Still alot of hate and looking for vengeance, i mean, wasnt the APOLOGY from Kevin Rudd enough ?

Now it wants modern generation Australia to pay for the "wrongs" of the British Empire who first established a colony at Botany bay in 1788 via a percentage of GDP annually plus renouncements of parks and rivers and thats just the tip of the ice berg........

The mind boggles.

 

[Mickyb64]

It's truly terrifying how the current Labour government wants to divide the country. I have no interest in being treated as a second class citizen in my own country. It's a No from me.

 

[TDITD]

"An obvious trojan horse imo."

Couldnt agree more, the thing that really disappoints me with the Uluru statement is that the tone of the statement is very much looking at the past still, some 240 yrs back , i mean when are we going to move forward and look to the future as a united australia ?

Still alot of hate and looking for vengeance, i mean, wasnt the APOLOGY from Kevin Rudd enough ?

Now it wants modern generation Australia to pay for the "wrongs" of the British Empire who first established a colony at Botany bay in 1788 via a percentage of GDP annually plus renouncements of parks and rivers and thats just the tip of the ice berg........

View attachment 41453

The mind boggles.

Yeah really disappointing read, all about division, anger, hatred. Like you say so far in the past too, it really makes me sad their are people out there like this. Professional victims.

Australia should be for one and all, all treated equal all treated fairly.

The amount of money wasted on aboriginal causes should be audited immediately and then streamlined and revolutionised in concert with elders those who are in these places, not elites. This would infinitely improve things just for a start, but nah it's really not about that after all.

 

[timb89]

Should this thread really be associated with AVZ? There's no connection.

 

[RHyNO]

Interesting discussion here. Appreciate the insight. So here’s a few discussion points.
1. The statement from the heart in not in fact a 26 page document. It is a single page statement that exists as part of a 26 page document that took a lot of work to create.
2. The voice does not promise to execute the 26 page document, any suggestion of this is standard fear mongering sky, to accompany their misinformation, it suggests that a body will be created to advocate for it. But it makes absolutely no promise that anything will be done. Merely a body to advocate for the rights of the indigenous.
3. Australia is far from colour blind and the only people saying that are wealthy white people.
4. Let’s play it out, the indigenous cop a .5% of our nation GDP as reparations, would this end the Australia we know? Or would it go a way to end the suffering of the people from whom this land was taken?

I can see a lot of wealth produced by this nation and very little of it going to the people who need it.
Having said all of this I am still out on the voice because I think it is a complete culture war scam being run as a distraction to the greater problems, like where the fuck are we going to get the minerals for the transition to electric transport and why are we constantly declaring war with China with whom we want to trade and work with.

 

[CHB]

Should this thread really be associated with AVZ? There's no connection.

I kind of agree with this. Is there a general thread on TSE that this can be moved to?

I'd rather no connection on anything political that's not related to AVZ. Too many trolls around.

 

[BEISHA]

I kind of agree with this. Is there a general thread on TSE that this can be moved to?

I'd rather no connection on anything political that's not related to AVZ. Too many trolls around.

Not sure what you and @timb89 are on about, this thread is completely separate to AVZ discussion thread, so just ignore if you dont want to contribute. No need to be concerned, i am rather capable of looking after any trolls that come my way........

 

[timb89]

Not sure what you and @timb89 are on about, this thread is completely separate to AVZ discussion thread, so just ignore if you dont want to contribute. No need to be concerned, i am rather capable of looking after any trolls that come my way........

Its in the AVZ group.

Nothing to be gained by having this here.

 

[BEISHA]

Its in the AVZ group.

Nothing to be gained by having this here.

"Nothing to be gained by having this here".............in your opinion.

Not mine.......suck it up, it aint moving.

Just IGNORE.

 

[timb89]

"Nothing to be gained by having this here".............in your opinion.

Not mine.......suck it up, it aint moving.

Just IGNORE.

Can you explain what is gained by directly connecting it with AVZ as opposed to having it on a general thread?

 

[BEISHA]

Can you explain what is gained by directly connecting it with AVZ as opposed to having it on a general thread?

"Trading opportunities ", "Mining Stocks worth researching for AVZ holders" are threads not related to AVZ, so you want those moved to a general thread too ?

The Voice may not have much correlation to AVZ per se, but has massive ramifications for any aussie miner who needs to comply with new indigenous heritage laws should the voice be voted in... politics / geopolitics can be indirectly linked with AVZ..........especially China....

TSE is a discussion forum, it adheres to the masses, not individual likes or dislikes.

imo

 

[timb89]

"Trading opportunities ", "Mining Stocks worth researching for AVZ holders" are threads not related to AVZ, so you want those moved to a general thread too ?

The Voice may not have much correlation to AVZ per se, but has massive ramifications for any aussie miner who needs to comply with new indigenous heritage laws should the voice be voted in... politics / geopolitics can be indirectly linked with AVZ..........especially China....

TSE is a discussion forum, it adheres to the masses, not individual likes or dislikes.

imo

Yes. They should be moved.

The voice has 0 correlation with AVZ. Do you not recall AFR article headlines stating racism amongst holders? I am in no way suggesting that. But again, what is gained by centralising the discussion to AVZ holders.

Should we have an abortion thread? Less babies has massive ramifications on EV adoption, more babies have massive ramifications on climate change, both affect AVZ.

Yes, TSE is for general discussion. The AVZ sub topic in the TSE forum is for?

 

[BEISHA]

Yes. They should be moved.

The voice has 0 correlation with AVZ. Do you not recall AFR article headlines stating racism amongst holders? I am in no way suggesting that. But again, what is gained by centralising the discussion to AVZ holders.

Should we have an abortion thread? Less babies has massive ramifications on EV adoption, more babies have massive ramifications on climate change, both affect AVZ.

Yes, TSE is for general discussion. The AVZ sub topic in the TSE forum is for?

"Should we have an abortion thread? Less babies has massive ramifications on EV adoption, more babies have massive ramifications on climate change, both affect AVZ."

Now you are just being plain silly........

I am not going to bang on with you any further, the thread stays, you either contribute to it or ...
......up to you.

I put alot of effort into this forum to provide variety, make it engaging and a success, can you say the same ?

I will be damned if i am going to change everything for the whim of a single random thats blown in ..the last dude who tried that, didnt end well for that individual .....

Move along, you are clogging the thread with crap.

imo

 

[timb89]

"Should we have an abortion thread? Less babies has massive ramifications on EV adoption, more babies have massive ramifications on climate change, both affect AVZ."

Now you are just being plain silly........

I am not going to bang on with you any further, the thread stays, you either contribute to it or ...
......up to you.

I put alot of effort into this forum to provide variety, make it engaging and a success, can you say the same ?

I will be damned if i am going to change everything for the whim of a single random thats blown in ..the last dude who tried that, didnt end well for that individual .....

Move along, you are clogging the thread with crap.

imo

I provided a ridiculous example of something that has an equally disconnected basis to AVZ. You hopefully see how silly connecting this to AVZ is.

You put alot of effort into this forum to provide variety? Why? You sound like you need a mens shed.

 

[BEISHA]

I provided a ridiculous example of something that has an equally disconnected basis to AVZ. You hopefully see how silly connecting this to AVZ is.

You put alot of effort into this forum to provide variety? Why? You sound like you need a mens shed.

 

[geo_au]

Its in the AVZ group.

Nothing to be gained by having this here.

I think it's an excellent thread for learning what The Voice is all about. Personally I feel this could have a detrimental affect on mining and other industries and could become a cash cow for for first nations people. What happened to first nations people over 200 years ago is not relevant today as their young have the same opportunities as anyone else. In a nutshell you and I had nothing to do with their treatment 200 plus years ago so time for them to move on.

 

[timb89]

I think it's an excellent thread for learning what The Voice is all about. Personally I feel this could have a detrimental affect on mining and other industries and could become a cash cow for for first nations people. What happened to first nations people over 200 years ago is not relevant today as their young have the same opportunities as anyone else. In a nutshell you and I had nothing to do with their treatment 200 plus years ago so time for them to move on.

You're correct. It may well.

But notice you said "mining industries" not AVZ. What is gained by connecting it to AVZ directly?

 

[BEISHA]

Interesting discussion here. Appreciate the insight. So here’s a few discussion points.
1. The statement from the heart in not in fact a 26 page document. It is a single page statement that exists as part of a 26 page document that took a lot of work to create.
2. The voice does not promise to execute the 26 page document, any suggestion of this is standard fear mongering sky, to accompany their misinformation, it suggests that a body will be created to advocate for it. But it makes absolutely no promise that anything will be done. Merely a body to advocate for the rights of the indigenous.
3. Australia is far from colour blind and the only people saying that are wealthy white people.
4. Let’s play it out, the indigenous cop a .5% of our nation GDP as reparations, would this end the Australia we know? Or would it go a way to end the suffering of the people from whom this land was taken?

I can see a lot of wealth produced by this nation and very little of it going to the people who need it.
Having said all of this I am still out on the voice because I think it is a complete culture war scam being run as a distraction to the greater problems, like where the fuck are we going to get the minerals for the transition to electric transport and why are we constantly declaring war with China with whom we want to trade and work with.

I am going to discuss some of your points...

1) Statement from the heart..

View The Statement - Uluru Statement from the Heart

Yes indeed, its condensed to a A4 sheet of paper, a 4.40 minute read , nicely put together, powerful, but........ambiguous, what is the detail that this statement is asking 97% of non indigenous people to vote for ?
The term " MAKARRATA" is used, what does that mean ?

What is a Makarrata? It's more than a synonym for treaty

Makarrata is much more than just a synonym for treaty. It is a complex Yolngu word describing a process of conflict resolution, peacemaking and justice.

www.abc.net.au

The term has many elements, in the main, its...

"The first one, and the main one, is peace after a dispute.

I am all for that for sure, lets ALL make peace as a united Australia and move on .

But Makarratta also means treaty / repatriation....sorry, thats where i have a problem....

2) Let me remind you of what Albanese has stated many times...

https://www.skynews.com.au/australia-news/politics/albanese-says-he-recommits-to-the-uluru-statement-from-the-heart-in-full/video/5ee4fd326be69d1c7d4aa46b0

The Uluru statement clearly says..........Makarrata is another word for Treaty or agreement making. And it is the culmination of our agenda'."

Promises , promises, does that word have any relevance with politicians ?....

3) "Australia is far from colour blind and the only people saying that are wealthy white people "

No disrespect, but that statement is bullshit, i think in the main non indigenous respects indigenous culture and wants them to do well, work hard , rise above the past and thrive.....alot have and my complete respect goes to them,......however, alot havnt and still stuck in the past , thats their bad !

4) Australias GDP is $1.7 trillion, so 0.5% = 8.5 Billion.........thats a shit load of dough!!.

What would 97% of australias population think about 3% indigenous getting that nice whack of dough ? Is that fair ? Could that cause more friction than already exists ?

Could we trust the Makarrata commission to utilise that money to the betterment of their people or could it be another ATSIC ?

Geoff Clark to stand trial on fraud-related charges involving $2m

Former ATSIC chair Geoff Clark has been ordered to stand trial on 380 charges relating to allegations he abused his position at Indigenous organisations for his own gain.

www.abc.net.au

5) why are we constantly declaring war with China with whom we want to trade and work with.

Thats a excellent geopolitical question and one we should explore on this thread.


Food for thought.

imo